Hot Topics, v. 2007.7

For discussions that need to be handled with extra care. NO FLAMING.

Continued from Hot Topics, v. 2007.6.

Date: August 31, 2007

Author: Robert Coontz (Administrator)

Categories: Life, The Universe

Comments RSS TrackBack 327 comments

1

the man for aeiou

in August 31st, 2007 @ 16:40

all right! I have wanted this for weeks!

what do you think of not talkng about religon. I am sorry but you clump cristains together. we are all differnt.

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2

widdershins

in August 31st, 2007 @ 16:55

I repeat what I said last thread.

As someone who has now told you all that I’m bisexual, this conversation is rather odd. I’m seeing myself looped in with the “them” and told that God may hate me. Gee, thanks. That just makes my day so much happier!

Sorry. I just don’t like seeing people say that a being that’s supposed to be all loving and all forgiving hates me for loving. Anyone see the irony in that?

Please think about it.

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3

Gwendolyn of the Eastern Seas

in August 31st, 2007 @ 19:12

Haha! Wonderful! Thankee, GAPAs!

Now, there is one topic on which I would love to know how Musers feel. And that topic is abortion.
I myself have an opinion on it. I think that it should really be an option if the mother’s health is seriously at risk, or if they are the victim of rape/incest. Otherwise, it’s your own dang fault the kid is there, deal with it or put it up for adoption. According to TIME, the demographics on abortion are contrary to this opinion. These are some explanations given by would-be mothers who aborted

-74%: Having a baby would dramatically change my life
-73%: Can’t afford baby right now
-48%: Don’t want to be a single mother.relationship problems
-38%: Has completed childbearing
-25%: Don’t want people to know they got pregnant
-22%: Don’t feel mature enough to raise a child
-13%: Problems with health of fetus
-12%: Problems with health of mother
-Less than 1.5%: Victim of rape/incest

About the fetus one- I think this should only be done if there is an almost certain to absolutely certain chance the child the child wil have a serious health defect that will probably cause death early on.
The problem with loads of groups is that they are entirely to focused on ideology. They don’t care about the women who come in. They care about a set of rules that dictate their values. Ideology is the mother of blind idiosyncracy, it seems to me.
What does everyone else think?

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4

the man for aeiou

in August 31st, 2007 @ 19:28

“The problem with loads of groups is that they are entirely to focused on ideology. They don’t care about the women who come in. They care about a set of rules that dictate their values. Ideology is the mother of blind idiosyncracy, it seems to me.”
yes!

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5

agagabagabag zepata

in August 31st, 2007 @ 19:29

2- Then you’re lucky he doesn’t exist.

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6

I, man-gator

in August 31st, 2007 @ 19:33

5-*sigh* I would respond but it’s up to other people to decide what they want…after all, all that they need to know is ‘the truth’

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7

the man for aeiou

in August 31st, 2007 @ 19:37

2- god does not hate homo- and bi-s.!

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8

I, man-gator

in August 31st, 2007 @ 19:43

that is true. over all-god does not hate. he loves. unless you’re catholic. And even then I don’t know much about that type of religion so…I might be wrong.

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9

the man for aeiou

in August 31st, 2007 @ 20:12

you know, it is type for a joke:
a man dies and goes to heven. as st. peter takes him to the man house st. peter says “shh. be quiet.”
“why?” asks the man.
“the babtists are in there and we have to make them think they are alone.”

please tell me if I hurt anyone!

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10

I, man-gator

in August 31st, 2007 @ 21:28

I heard that one on a radio show.

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11

widdershins

in August 31st, 2007 @ 21:45

I wasn’t really asking if the christian God hated me or not. I for one, don’t really beleive in a christian God, I believe in a sort of connection, of loving each other and caring. That’s the sort of God thing I think of. I was bothered by the discussion though because it seemed like you were discussing whether or not you hate me or whether or not Christians hate me. I know most Christians don’t but it’s still hurtful to hear you say “oh, well, we’re not sure but… they might hate you!”

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12

Shadowkat

in September 1st, 2007 @ 09:36

11-Well, even if there is a God, and even if He does hate you, I don’t! *hug*

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13

Traggle

in September 1st, 2007 @ 09:41

PLEASE PEOPLE, NO RELIGION.

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14

Lizzie

in September 1st, 2007 @ 10:53

heh, music geek joke:
These three cellists die, and go up to the Pearly Gates. They meet St. Peter there. He asks the first cellist, “So who did you study with when you were on earth?” The cellist answers, nervously, “Rostrapovich.” St. Peter says, “sorry, go to Hell.” Second cellist steps up, St. Pete asks him the same thing, the cellist answers, “Pablo Casals.” “Sorry, go to Hell,” replies St. Peter. Finally, the third cellist steps up. “And who did you study with?” asks St. Peter. “J-j-janos Starker,” the cellist replies nervously. “Come in, come in!” says St. Peter, now smiling broadly. “You’ve already been through hell!”

Okay, so that makes no sense to any of you, probably.

3 – I think that it should be up to the mother to decide what warrents having an abortion; basically, my philosophy is, “If you don’t like abortions, don’t have one.”

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15

Capricious The Great and Terrible (cappy)

in September 1st, 2007 @ 12:29

2- No way! Being Bisexual or Homosexual doesn’t make you a different PERSON. I wouldn’t treat you any different. I know some people like that, so maybe it’s easier for me. But it’s fine.

For some reason, gay relationships don’t bother me at all, but lesbian relationships make me uncomfortable. Maybe it’s having to do with being female myself.

3- I’m completely against it. COMPLETELY. I believe it’s wrong to deny a life that has ALREADY BEGUN. But I do not dislike people that think it’s okay, I just don’t think the same thing.
If you were raped, I can understand it, but I still don’t like it.

11- I’m Cristian, but I agree with you on the God thing. I think that ‘God’ could be a form of the forces of nature.

13- Why not? As long as we’re respectful.

I’m Lutheran. But I have my own beliefs.

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16

Kagcomix the Special

in September 1st, 2007 @ 12:48

2- everyone has a different concept of God. The God I beleive in loves everyone. My parents stoped going to a church because of the stand they were taking against homosexauls and bisexuals.

I myself am protestant. I like going to church but I havent been in years. I have this friend who hates christmas sooooooo much because of how much it’s advertised (she’s jewish) but it kind of hurts to hear her put down my religion. like, we’ll just be walking along and she’ll be like: “I hate christmas. it’s stupid”

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17

Capricious The Great and Terrible (cappy)

in September 1st, 2007 @ 13:18

16- I But then, doesn’t that make the enemy herself? Because she’s being what she hates?

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18

Gwendolyn of the Eastern Seas

in September 1st, 2007 @ 13:22

2- I have a friend who is bisexual. Her name is Mandy, and she is one heck of a fantasy writer. And she acts perfectly normal. Everyone who is really anti-gay acts like it’s wrong, and that God is going to send them to Hell if they’re fanatically religious. God, according to most Christians with half a brain, is a benign being who loves everyone, no matter what. So really, you can just disregard all the haters out there who are so uncomfortable with people being different that they spread lies like that.

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19

agagabagabag zepata

in September 1st, 2007 @ 13:36

Okay, let me say it this way: If a supreme being existed, it wouldn’t be supreme if it was a homophobe. God either doesn’t hate bis/homos (sorry for the term, just an abbr.), or doesn’t exist.
There’s this short little dude who’s crude, rascist, and homophobic. I am the king of outcasts. I hope to make it through high school without strangling him.

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20

Rebecca Lasley (Administrator)

in September 1st, 2007 @ 13:44

(17) Curious, isn’t it, how often that happens.

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21

Capricious The Great and Terrible (cappy)

in September 1st, 2007 @ 13:44

19- Wouldn’t you rather strangle him?

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22

Traggle

in September 1st, 2007 @ 14:01

15- I’m fine as long as people are respectful. but that doesn’t usually happen.

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23

agagabagabag zepata

in September 1st, 2007 @ 14:07

19- Yes, actually.

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24

oxlin widdershins

in September 1st, 2007 @ 19:43

18- ooh, I wonder if being bisexual makes one more inclined to fantasy writing. Joking, but it’s interesting that she and I both write fantasy… well mine’s more urban fantasy and I started fairly recently. But still.

Relgion-wise, I’m really not sure what I am. I don’t know, really. I like the concepts in Unitarian Universalism though I’ve not really looked into it that much. And I connect a lot with Jewish culture, having been surrounded by it for so long as a member of the local JCC. And I was raised Christian, actually. If there is a Christian God, I can’t imagine a God that does not love everyone and wish all to love each other as well.

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25

Capricious The Great and Terrible (cappy)

in September 2nd, 2007 @ 13:46

24- Urban fantasy? That is so cool! I would have never thought of it!

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26

agagabagabag zepata

in September 2nd, 2007 @ 18:32

3- There’s nothing wrong with it. We make to big a deal about killing things that don’t care one way or the other.

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27

Ê‘yviva

in September 2nd, 2007 @ 19:15

19- please read my comment on the last hot topics thread. (comment #398, https://musefanpage.com/blog/?p=952). an application of this concpet would be that G “hates” when someone chooses the path that is wrong for them.

3- i think that from the time the baby would survive if born, abortion should be illegal. if a baby is born at 2 months, it won’t survive and abortion should be legal. if the baby is born at 8 1/2 months, it will survive anfd abortion should not be legal.
this is based off of my opinion that it is human life we are conserned with and not a bunch of cells. from hte time the fetus has the capability to function as a person it should live. before that, however, it is only a potential person.
if abortion were made flat out illegal, illegal abortion would still take place and this type would be much more dangerous for the mother.

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28

Unintended Pun

in September 2nd, 2007 @ 21:42

27-You have some good points about abortion.

I used to be completely for abortion, then I was for it with health risks or rape/incest. Now I’m not really sure where I stand. I was reading this thing that said:
If you knew a woman who was pregnant, who had 8 kids already, three of whom were deaf, two who were blind, one mentally retarded, and she had
syphilis, would you recommend that she have an abortion?

She was pregnant with Ludwig van Beethoven.

That made me think what if the baby was born instead of aborted and grew up to change the world?
But then again if you knew your baby would have a health problem would you want to let it live with that?

I’m getting into an argument with myself now. Goodbye!

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29

Robert Coontz (Administrator)

in September 2nd, 2007 @ 21:52

Snopes.com adds some perspective to the Beethoven question:

http:// www. snopes.com/ glurge/ twoquestions.asp

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30

Capricious The Great and Terrible (cappy)

in September 3rd, 2007 @ 01:35

Is Hot Topic a hot topic? ^_^

I love that store. Sorry, off topic.

Yeah, I can completely agree with Ê‘yviva on abortion.

Has anyone seen those ProLife billboards? That are anti-abortion?

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31

Sweet Melpomene

in September 3rd, 2007 @ 06:59

3- I go back and forth about this one all the time. I’m really unsure. I think I’d only agree if the fetus was going to have a horrid birth defect, such as being born with the brain outside part of the skull or something of the like that would cause death shortly after birth. On the same sort of issue, I feel that the morning-after pill is acceptable. Also, I’m all for any sort of contraceptive. But I’m totally against killing anything that’s moved to development past a cluster of cells. Even if the mother was raped or her health’s threatened. If it’s the first case, why kill the kid because she didn’t chose the father? The child didn’t chose him either. If it’s the second, she should grow a backbone.

13- I miss that thread a lot.

RE: sexuality: It happens, don’t hate. I refuse to believe in a God who damns people for something they cannot help. The only thing that annoys me is excessive PDA from any sort of couple.

RE: religion: I’m, as I’ve stated, agnostic/atheistic. As in, I don’t believe in any supreme beings in the traditional sense of the word, but don’t think we can know either way. However I do believe in reincarnation and multiple dimensions but that’s a long post for another time. I also find belief systems to be intensely interesting.

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32

Shadowkat

in September 3rd, 2007 @ 09:18

31-*applause*

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33

agagabagabag zepata

in September 3rd, 2007 @ 12:07

28- Okay, but it would still have been a good idea to get an abortion.
30- What about them?

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34

Gwendolyn of the Eastern Seas

in September 3rd, 2007 @ 12:45

27- *applause* Very. nice.
28- I actually did do that once. I said that she shouldn’t, because there was still the possibility the child may live. I mean, unless there is concrete evidence about the baby being carried (NOT about its sibilings), you should let it live.

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35

Capricious The Great and Terrible (cappy)

in September 3rd, 2007 @ 14:15

33- They’re what informed me about abortion in the first place. :-/

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36

agagabagabag zepata

in September 3rd, 2007 @ 14:45

But does that mean you’re pro-life? I don’t think the baby cares. If tiy don’t care about death, then you don’t really care about staying alive. We humans only hate dying because we’re raised that way. We even refuse to die. As someone once said, “Religion denies death, the only fact we have.

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37

Gwendolyn of the Eastern Seas

in September 3rd, 2007 @ 15:32

31- But what if the mother were to almost certainly die in childbirth? How would you like to leave your own child motherless, even parentless if there was no father to be held accountable as a guardian?

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38

dark duke of darkness

in September 3rd, 2007 @ 17:39

okay, i just thought this was really funny.
“god does not hate. he loves. unless you’re catholic”
but it seems that unless we want a discussion on the ridiculousness of Christianity, then all of the comments on God are slightly off-topic.
on abortion. whether to abort or not is completely the decision of the mother, at every stage. if a mother decides to have a baby, and then when 8 months pregnant says, “you know what, i really dont want a child”, i think that that is ridiculous and wrong, but still the mother’s choice.
31-grow a backbone? you are willing to sacrifice someone’s life to bring a baby into the world that would live miserably? fetuses are not human, and therefore the mother’s health is a much higher priority. kind of like saying, lets save the much loved family dog, at the cost of our teenage daughter’s happiness.

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39

Kagcomix the Special

in September 3rd, 2007 @ 17:49

17- i don’t know what you mean. my friend who hates christmas is jewish.

on abortion: i think it has to do with the situation.

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40

I, man-gator

in September 3rd, 2007 @ 17:50

38-sorry, I’m sure I’m not actually right. it just seems that catholic is much more strict, and has a stronger vision of hell…

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41

agagabagabag zepata

in September 3rd, 2007 @ 17:55

38- right on! But I don’t know about the analogy. Wouldn’t you like it to live?

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42

Shadowkat

in September 4th, 2007 @ 14:16

38-That was a very bad analogy, or at least extremely incomplete. And there you go, looking out for the mother, who is the one who “screwed up” in the first place…I’m sorry, but people have to pay for their mistakes, generally. And, yes, in the case of rape or incest, it’s unfortunate, but then you grab the guy, make him pay (if you can), and put the child up for adoption. Life sucks…that’s just the way it is.

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43

Sweet Melpomene

in September 4th, 2007 @ 15:15

37- Hmm, I dunno. Like, if she’d just be a bit unhealthy and possibly not be able to have any additional children, let it live. And [yes, I don’t have medical evidence on which to base this, but I’m just trying to think it out] if she’d die in childbirth, she’d be pretty far along, and a partial abortion would probably be nearly as bad, she could still have major issues… *goes to think on this* Hmm, do a Google search on Maternity Worldwide.

38- If fetuses aren’t human, what, exactly, are they?

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44

Kagcomix the Special

in September 4th, 2007 @ 16:04

40- yeah catholicism kind of scares me when it’s at the extreme.

38- i don’t under stand what you mean when you say fetuses aren’t human. they are human but at the most primitave point of the process of our creation. if fetuses aren’t human, what are we?

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45

Fortune Cell

in September 4th, 2007 @ 16:38

On abortion: 8 months? Seriously? The baby can live outside the womb then. By that point, it’s murder. My cousin was born around then, maybe even earlier.
But I think abortion should still be allowed up through the first or second trimester. If the mother hasn’t gotten it by then, then that’s her problem. 5 months or so is enough time to make that decision.
Also, the morning-after pill isn’t an abortion pill or anything, it’s just a higher dose of the birth control pill.
43- They’re humans in development. Same reason an egg isn’t a chicken. It might be a chicken in the future, but not yet.
Oh, and if the fetus will end up being born with some sort of mental handicap, I say abort it. We have too many people as it is, and those people will end up being a drain on society. It sounds harsh, but it’s true.

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46

dark duke of darkness

in September 4th, 2007 @ 17:18

okay. sorry about the analogy. it was incomplete.
fetuses are not human, just as sperm cells are not human. they have to potential to develop into humans. it is a “human” fetus, but it is also a “human” fingernail.
45-oops. didnt see that. hope you dont mind me reiterating. and yes, 8 months. personally, i think that would be wrong, and i would advise against it, but is it still the mother’s choice.
44-religion scares me. all the time.

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47

I, man-gator

in September 4th, 2007 @ 19:41

46-why does religion scare you? It shouldn’t. there’s nothing to be scared about. As far as I know, but, heck, I’m just a kid!

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48

dark duke of darkness

in September 4th, 2007 @ 20:53

religion makes people do scary things. also, the sheer amount of brainwashed people. its very scary.

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49

oxlin widdershins

in September 4th, 2007 @ 21:52

Abortion: oxlin is pro-choice and in accordance with Zyv. yup. I beleive it should be the mother’s choice up until 3 months. After that I think it shouldn’t be legal as then the child could survive on it’s own. I don’t necessarily think that it is the right choice, but in some situations it may be and it should be an option up until 3 months.

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50

Robert Coontz (Administrator)

in September 4th, 2007 @ 21:56

If abortion were illegal, how would you enforce the law? What should be done to women who went ahead and had one anyway?

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51

oxlin widdershins

in September 4th, 2007 @ 22:13

I do not think abortion should be illegal. if it were, the women that Robert mentions would be getting much riskier abortions that would compromise their health. The clinics would be providing illegal and therefore more dangerous care.

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52

Robert Coontz (Administrator)

in September 4th, 2007 @ 22:19

You said in comment 49 that it should be illegal after the first trimester (three months into the pregnancy). If it were illegal, presumably there would be some punishment for breaking the law. That’s what I was asking about.

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53

oxlin widdershins

in September 4th, 2007 @ 22:34

52- first of all, omgyay! a GAPA talking! Second, I guess i meant discouraged more. Or something. I’m not quite sure how the law works even now, it just seems a bit unhealthy for the mother at that time. And I think I’m actually pro choice but in that post I was trying to compromise more than I should have. Or something. Or agreeing with Zyv who puts things better than I do. I’m just… I dunno. Pro choice?

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54

Shadowkat

in September 5th, 2007 @ 18:32

50-Punishment would be tying the would-be mother’s tubes (making it so she can’t get pregnant, for those of you who haven’t heard that expression). That way, even though she’s already had the abortion, we can be sure she won’t have another.

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55

Ebeth The Titleless

in September 5th, 2007 @ 19:35

So scenario-you’re poor and uneducated, and you’ve just had an abortion because you knew you couldn’t support the baby (or survive the birth because you had a horrible health care plan). So the government says “Well, for that heinious crime, we are going to TIE YOUR TUBES!”

What happens if they then say “Oh good, i’ve been wanting to get that done for AGES, but you know how it is, i just couldn’t afford it”?

not much of a punishment then, is it? they get their tubes tied for free

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56

I, man-gator

in September 5th, 2007 @ 19:52

It’d have to be tried in court, so they could decide if they really should have that done to them. It really depends on how big a crime it would be considered.

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57

oxlin widdershins

in September 5th, 2007 @ 20:37

It just doesn’t seem like it should be a crime to me to decide that you’re pregnant with someone you can’t support so you choose not to have the child. I just don’t get why someone would be punished for not being able to support the child.

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58

Fortune Cell

in September 5th, 2007 @ 20:44

I don’t know if it’s been brought up, but what about when women who would get abortions anyways, illegal or not. They often are very dangerous, and can end up killing the mother and the fetus. Self-defeating, much?

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59

I, man-gator

in September 5th, 2007 @ 20:52

57-that sounds like grounds for adoption.

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60

agagabagabag zepata

in September 5th, 2007 @ 21:32

54- But then she can’t have babies when she’s ready.

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61

dark duke of darkness

in September 5th, 2007 @ 22:53

59-yes, having millions of extra kids who need to be adopted is an excellent idea!

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62

Fortune Cell

in September 6th, 2007 @ 18:41

59- Pregnancy is expensive. Delivery is expensive. There are hospital bills, bills for maternity clothing, etc. Then you have to figure out what to say to people when they ask if you have a name picked out yet, or who give you clothes, or ask what happened to the baby. And there’s maternity leave, meaning you have to stop going to work. And there are just too many unadopted children as it is, why add to that? It’s not like the baby will magically get some new family or something, more likely they’ll end up in the foster care system, which can be horrible.

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63

dark duke of darkness

in September 6th, 2007 @ 19:10

62-okay, that was much better phrased.

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64

agagabagabag zepata

in September 6th, 2007 @ 23:18

62- Yes, hear hear!

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65

Unintended Pun

in September 7th, 2007 @ 15:04

58-I agree with that. Even though some people already do illegal abortions, there are plenty of people who get legal ones. If they banned them the people who currently get legal abortions would also get illegal ones.

62-Very well put

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66

Shadowkat

in September 7th, 2007 @ 19:10

Oh, for Heaven’s sake…having “tied tubes” as punishment might definitely make a girl think twice about fooling around, though.

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67

agagabagabag zepata

in September 7th, 2007 @ 19:17

66- But that would be a pointless lesson, unless she was reincarnated.

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68

Shadowkat

in September 8th, 2007 @ 14:17

67-What??? *look of utter bewilderment*

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69

agagabagabag zepata

in September 8th, 2007 @ 19:14

Forget the reincarnation thing for a second. Now, if she had her tubes tied, she might learn a good lesson, but it would be pointless, because she couldn’t have children ever again! lt’s like saying sex is bad, which is crazy.
As for the reincarnation thing, that would be the only way for her to have children in the future.

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70

I, man-gator

in September 8th, 2007 @ 20:30

69-but, when people are dead, don’t they realize they’re better off dead?

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71

Ê‘yviva

in September 8th, 2007 @ 21:09

re punishment: if abortion where to be made illegal, it would be because the fetus would be considered “human”, then having an abortion owuld be infanticide and the mother would have to be tried and punished as such.

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72

Margaret

in September 8th, 2007 @ 21:43

My opinion on abortion is that it’s the mother’s choice, because it’s true that having a baby is a big deal. If, god forbid, anything were to happen to me personally (getting raped, whatever) I can’t see myself having an abortion. For myself, I couldn’t come to terms with that, despite not being religious or anything. But I feel no need to impose my belief on any other woman and if a friend of mine, for example, were to get an abortion, I wouldn’t think less of her. It’s my own personal choice, and I think everyone else should have the right to make their own decision. (Not that I can imagine any likely scenario where that would happen. -shudders-)

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73

oxlin widdershins

in September 8th, 2007 @ 23:04

72- agreed. I have no clue what I would decide but I believe that everyone has the right to decide for themselves.

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74

Kagcomix the Special

in September 9th, 2007 @ 11:20

45- my aunt has down syndrome. she is not a problem to society. she is very kind and gental and has a job.

62- I think that it (money for delivery/hospital) would be less of a problem up here becasue we don’t pay huge hospital bills. i would explain but i don’t understand it myself.but what you said was well put.

72- it would have to do with how old i was if it happend. to prevent the choice of abortion for myself i’m not going to have sex untill i’m married. there are other reasons i’m not having sex untill i’m married as well.

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75

oxlin widdershins

in September 9th, 2007 @ 13:27

45, 74- I know around 6 people with down syndrome. None of them are problems to society. They’re very nice and loving people.

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76

dark duke of darkness

in September 9th, 2007 @ 16:59

70-no, because they’re dead. *wonders how exactly this is related*.
71-why wouldnt the doctor in question be tried and punished instead?
74-not to be mean or offensive, but some people with down syndrome cannot have a job. your aunt is an exception. anyhoo, down syndrome is nowhere near the only birth defect in existence.
“to prevent the choice of abortion for myself i’m not going to have sex untill i’m married”-i’m sorry, but at least that reason for not havin premarital sex is ridiculous. what makes you think that if you are impregnated when you’re married that you will want to keep the baby>?also, have you ever heard of birth control?
73-eggxactly!

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77

Sir Rup

in September 9th, 2007 @ 18:15

76- the docter would also be tried, as the accomplice. both would have done something to make the fetus die. the mother, by going to the procedure and the doctor, by doing it.

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78

Shadowkat

in September 9th, 2007 @ 18:59

71-Excellent point.

73-But I also think that the fetus should have a choice. Would you kill a frog is someone gave it to you, just because you didn’t want it? I mean, it’s not human, and it doesn’t know what’s going on…it’s still a living being, though!

76-@RE:71–Because, it was the mother’s choice, not the doctor’s.

77-(with reference to my RE:76)–I suppose.

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79

Unintended Pun

in September 9th, 2007 @ 19:38

78-(in the RE to 73) But the fetus can’t choose. If it’s still in the developmental stages where it can’t survive outside the mother’s body it should be considered a part of the mother’s body, but when the baby can survive it can be considered a seperate person from the mother, which would make abortion illegal at that point. I understand where you’re coming from with the frog metaphor, and that the fetus is living, but the fetus is a part of the mother’s body and a person has every right to have a body part removed if they want to.

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80

Purple Panda

in September 9th, 2007 @ 20:41

I think what people mean about people with Down Syndrome being a problem to society is that sometimes they need someone to take care of them – and when their parents die, it’s their children’s responsibility – and if they didn’t have children and there’s nobody else to take care of them, it becomes a bit of a problem. Not everyone needs this, but I think it’s just another thing to think about when having a child…

(I think that’s what Fortune Cell was talking about, but I’m not positive)

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81

Gwendolyn of the Eastern Seas

in September 10th, 2007 @ 20:34

I’m not going to bless the world with my offspring (winkwink) until after I’m married, either. Hopefully by that time my husband and I will have a stable situation, and we can afford to have children and create a safe, nurturing environment for them.
My mom gave me “The Talk” recently (she claims she did it after Kristina, my four-year-old sister, was born, but I have no recollection of this), and there are plenty of good reasons not to go messing around. A girl at my school (she was 13!) is about two months pregnant (she left recently), and her parents had tried desperately to support her, let her know that they love her, and keep her away from her creepazoid sixteen-year-old boyfriend, but she sneaked out often and wham! Now she’s pregnant. They’re still taking care of her, giving her vitamins to support the child and housing her and trying to be the best parents they can be, but her life is pretty much ruined now. I mean, she can’t get a proper diploma even from middle school (or at least not for some time), and she’s saying she’s going to marry the creepazoid when she turns sixteen. He can’t be good for her. I just feel awful for that child, and her future children. Imagine what life is going to be like for them. And this girl is not nice or maternal. At all. Poor things…

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82

agagabagabag zepata (trevor the decent)

in September 10th, 2007 @ 20:40

Me neither, but you can still have sex before then. [/blunt]

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83

oxlin widdershins

in September 10th, 2007 @ 21:21

I don’t quite see the point in saying that you’re specifically waiting until marriage but I don’t see the point in running around and having sex a lot either. I don’t especially want to have sex anytime soon but don’t necessarily want to wait until marriage either. I’m not ready and i”m waiting until I am but that’s not necessarily marriage. yup.

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84

agagabagabag zepata (trevor the decent)

in September 10th, 2007 @ 21:28

I don’t think l’ll need to wait til marriage. ln my mind, pre-marriage sex is great as long as you use a condom.
ANYway, can we have a hot topic change?

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85

oxlin widdershins

in September 10th, 2007 @ 21:35

sure. I’m all for a topic change. ‘course, that doesn’t actually mean I’ve got a topic. Not that we *need* a topic. But yeah.

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86

Shadowkat

in September 11th, 2007 @ 15:28

79-That’s a good point…I’ll have to think on that.

84-*wants to argue…decides not to*
Sure, a topic change sounds excellent! But to what…?

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87

the man for aeiou

in September 11th, 2007 @ 17:28

86- 9/11? that was good last year. we got pie planet off of that.

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88

Shadowkat

in September 13th, 2007 @ 14:45

87-Well, I can’t join in that argument, I’ll get called a “conspiracy theorist”. What about…hm…ah! Let’s talk about advertising today, and how it affects the emotions and lifestyle of the next generation!

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89

the man for aeiou

in September 13th, 2007 @ 16:16

88- I read a book about that, or at least a chapter was about. toy sellers are making toys and advertising them in a way that … ( I forgot.)

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90

Kagcomix the Special

in September 13th, 2007 @ 17:11

76- wooow. that’s out of comtext…. “there are other reasons for not having sex before marrige as well” i just don’t want to list them. as for birth control: uh YEAH i’ve heard of it but what if one day I decided to be stupid and have unprotected sex with some guy…… never should have spoken…… ignore me.

76- my aunt is not an exception LOADS of people with down syndrome can work. if you’re going to say people with down syndrome aren’t good for society, then what are old people? if an old person is in need of a lot of health care should we just kill them and get it over with? at least people with down syndrome can work.

80- there are homes for people with down syndrome. just like elderly people homes. my aunt lives in one of those now because my grandma can’t take care of her.

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91

oxlin widdershins

in September 13th, 2007 @ 17:31

All the people that I know who have down syndrome are high school age or elementary school age but they are definately able to work when they want to.

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92

Kagcomix the Special

in September 14th, 2007 @ 16:32

88- you mean as in the eight year olds who wear makeup and have purses and wear clothes that give off the wrong message?

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93

agagabagabag zepata (trevor the decennt)

in September 14th, 2007 @ 18:17

86-No, l want to know your opinion.

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94

dark duke of darkness

in September 15th, 2007 @ 01:48

79-“a person has every right to have a body part removed if they want to.” do they actually? im not quite sure.wouldn’t it be a bit like euthanasia? “cut off my leg please!” what doctor would actually do that?
80-yep
81-that’s horrible! people who would a-deny abortion to such a person, or b-brainwash a person int thinking that abortion is a bad idea in that case, i have no respect for. well, maybe some, but thats just wrong. also, at risk of repeating myself, have you ever heard of birth control.? not that i think people should have sex at 13, but if you want to, you dont have to get pregnant. (Assuming you’re female, of course. )

aaaaaand now that ive inputted my opinion, y’alls can feel free to do a topic change.

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95

Gwendolyn of the Eastern Seas

in September 15th, 2007 @ 10:02

94- She doesn’t want an abortion. And yes, I am a girl. Gwendolyn is a girl’s name, dear.

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96

Shadowkat

in September 15th, 2007 @ 18:06

93-I just, as a matter of personal opinion, don’t think that sex before marriage is the best thing to do. But, according to Libertarian principle, I can’t impose my personal opinions on anyone else, so it’s kind of a moot point.

95-I think he meant “Assuming you’re female” in a general sense.

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97

agagabagabag zepata (trevor the decent)

in September 15th, 2007 @ 18:46

96- But wouldn’t it be better to speak your mind?

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98

Sweet Melpomene

in September 15th, 2007 @ 20:09

97- She spoke her mind. But doesn’t want to force her opinions on people. As in, she thinks sex before marriage isn’t a good idea, but won’t go telling people off for doing it. I think. Yes?

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99

Shadowkat

in September 16th, 2007 @ 09:34

98-Excellent! You could be my official interpreter.
*gives pie to SM, in whatever flavor is SM’s favorite*

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100

Gwendolyn of the Eastern Seas

in September 17th, 2007 @ 19:05

98- Sweet bleeding marmosets, it’s SM! When did you return?

Hm… why don’t we discuss the Petraeus report? What a history-shaping report it is turning out to be.

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101

dark duke of darkness

in September 18th, 2007 @ 15:42

100-what is that? enlighten me. *humbly apologizes for his ignorance*

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102

Shadowkat

in September 21st, 2007 @ 18:56

100-Me too.

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103

Gwendolyn of the Eastern Seas

in September 21st, 2007 @ 20:35

General David Petraeus’s report of progress in Iraq, He is in charge of the surge there.

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104

Kagcomix the Special

in September 22nd, 2007 @ 15:33

Is gay marrige legal in the US? or is it just Canada?
How does the US government work?
Have you ever seen the Rick Mercer report and what do you think of it?

those aren’t hot topices, i was just wondering.

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105

oxlin widdershins

in September 22nd, 2007 @ 15:55

104- -Sadly, only in Massachusets though New York accepts the Massachussets marriages as legal

-err… that would take a while to explain How does your government work?

-Nope, sorry.

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106

Kagcomix the Special

in September 22nd, 2007 @ 17:06

105- i’m not entirely sure, I failed the government section of gr.5 social studies, it was really hard.

we have several parties that are in the house of commons. the three major ones are the Liberals(red), the Conservatives(blue) and the NDP(orange). steven harper is a conservative. roght now we have a conservative government. we had a liberal gov. for a very long time. the other parties are the green party and block quebecqoise. there’s something about determining how many seats each party has in the house of commons but I have forgotten.

there are upcoming provincial elections for something or other (complicated). there are different ridings throughout the cities… something I also don’t understand.

anyways, if you ever get to go to the parlement building in ottawa, do go. it’s really cool. their library is real awesome.

I can ask my parents about the government if what i said confused you.

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107

agagabagabag zepata (trevor the decent)

in September 22nd, 2007 @ 17:11

104- The government works like this: Stupid people vote for a stupid president, then complain about him.

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108

Kagcomix the Special

in September 22nd, 2007 @ 19:48

107- i meant other than that. like what parties there are and stuff.

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109

agagabagabag zepata (trevor the decent)

in September 22nd, 2007 @ 19:59

Please, no one be offended by this. Just laugh at me for being so ignorant.
Note: This in order of conservatism
The Republican party: ldiots. Fight wars for oil and religion.
The Libertarian Party: Kooks. (sorry, SK.) Don’t believe in taxes.
The Independent Party: Wishy-washy conservatives.
The Democratic Party: The only hope for liberals. More conservative than other liberals.
The Peace and Freedom Party: Wishy-washy but peaceful liberals.
The Green Party: Peace out, man.
But seriously.
The republican party believes in a republic, which means that citizens vote for a leader. The downside is that leaders can change their views, and still be in office. The US is a republic.
The Democratic party idealy believes in a government run by the people, who would vote directly on issues, but since the US is a republic, this is impossible. Democrats try to give people as much choice as they can, unless the people are idiots. (They are mostly idoits, which is why democrats won’t get elected. lt’s a death spiral.)
ls that helpful?

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110

the man for aeiou

in September 22nd, 2007 @ 21:21

107- there are two partys: the democrats and the republicans.
the democrats are older, and want to regulate bis.
the republicans are newer ( liclon was the frist republican pres) and what a more adam smith style gov.
the demicarts (liberals) are blue and the republicans(conseritves) are red

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111

Shadowkat

in September 24th, 2007 @ 21:26

109-Say what you will. I’m not offended, as long as you thoroughly believe that what you’re saying is true. Do some research on something before you make an opinion about it.
It’s also not that we “don’t believe in taxes”, we just don’t believe in unlawful taxes, according to the Constitution.

And now, dear Kagy, I will post my political party explanation–

Liberals: People who think that the gov’t needs to step in on every little thing to make sure that life is fair.
Democrats: A lot like the Liberals, but different in that they believe in social freedom, and economic restraint.*
Republicans: Almost opposites of the Democrats, they support economic liberty, and social restraint.*
Conservatives: These people are hard to peg on their exact views, as these views tend to vary from person to person, but, in general, they like economic liberty, and only minor social control.
Libertarians: They support both economic and social liberty, as long as one’s action does not interfere with anyone else’s right to those freedoms. (You can find a more in-depth explanation of Libertarianism on the HT v. 2007.6 thread.)
Constitutionalists: Adhere strictly to the Constitution. There’s not much else to say.
Greens: They’re not really a “major” party, but they want to make the world completely organic, essentially, and some (the extremists) would love to ban cars.
Independents: Frankly, it depends on the candidate.
(I’ve never heard of a “Peace and Freedom Party”, so I can’t say anything about it. But I will say that anyone who can be called a liberal probably doesn’t support freedom of any kind.)

* Neither Democrats nor Republicans quite stick to their views, in general…they tend to do whatever suits their purpose, generally.

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112

Shadowkat

in September 24th, 2007 @ 21:26

Lolz…sorry about the redundancy in the note at the end.

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113

agagabagabag zepata (trevor the decent)

in September 24th, 2007 @ 22:13

111-You make yourself sound like the best, which you aren’t. And liberals aren’t a party. Democrats, greens, and peace and freedoms are liberals.
About that thing at the end: l don’t get it. Liberals are all about freedom and being who you are, while conservatives (which is a general category, not a party) mostly wish for everyone to be the same.

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114

Shadowkat

in September 25th, 2007 @ 15:09

113-I did my version of all the political parties you listed, which included Conservatives. And you’re mixed up; liberals are the ones who want conformity, whereas conservatives (in most cases) don’t mind what everyone does, as long as it doesn’t harm anyone else. They’re stricter and more limiting than Libertarians are. And, yes, Libertarians are the best. I suppose, to each their own, but don’t you (or anyone else) dare impose your way of life on me if I don’t like it.

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115

Traggle

in September 25th, 2007 @ 15:24

114- You are extremely confused. The technical definition of liberal is someone that supports change, which would mean that they don’t really try to control what people do. Example: CONSERVATIVE Christians think that gay marriage is wrong because it goes against the Bible. They are trying to control people’s lives. Liberals think that gay marriage is okay, and they don’t think that everybody should conform to the same definition of marriage. And some advice, to anyone, know what you’re talking about before you say something.

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116

Shadowkat

in September 25th, 2007 @ 19:09

115-Actually, no, if you actually pay attention to what those Conservatives do and vote for and such, you’ll notice that, as with most political parties, they always want everyone to act how they want them to. Whether that’s extremely controlled or only slightly is irrelevant. And as to the Liberal/gay marriage thing, when you say that they figure gay marriage is ok, and that not everyone should conform to the same definition of marriage, you mean that they want to force any pastor (or such), no matter what his personal convictions, to marry whoever asks him to do so. And just because someone gets in a tizzy about the definition of a word, they can’t change it. But that’s a side note.
And same to you. You know, I wouldn’t have to write so much if people would just admit they were wrong.

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117

agagabagabag zepata (trevor the decent)

in September 25th, 2007 @ 19:18

116- You know? That’s completely wrong. Look up liberal. And for gay marriages, why wouldn’t a pastor marry anyone who asked? lt’s part of his job. You also might want to look up freedom.

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118

Shadowkat

in September 25th, 2007 @ 19:26

117-You look those up, then tell me what they mean. I did, and I think we might be seeing different definitions. And it is NOT a pastor’s job to marry anyone that asks, he has a choice. Or at least he should.

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119

agagabagabag zepata (trevor the decent)

in September 25th, 2007 @ 19:46

He should? By whose standards? Yours?

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120

Gwendolyn of the Eastern Seas

in September 25th, 2007 @ 19:57

Right-o, Kag. I’ll give you a comparitively brief explanation of how the much-beloved, much-despised American government works.

Judiciary Branch

The branch of government that deals with lawsuits, wills, civil disputes, criminals, etc. You have many local courts, state courts, and the Supreme Court, which is based in Washington D.C. It is for very important cases (by definition; not all cases that pass through there are important, and not all cases that are important pass through there). The court consists of justices appointed by the president. It is one’s duty as a citizen of the United States to attend jury duty at court every once in awhile. Most of the time, you just go in for jury duty and it wouldn’t really matter if it were you at the case or any other citizen. In special cases, though, a jury must be selected based on how unbiased they will be towards the days. It is notoriously difficult to get an unbiased jury for publicized cases.

Legislative Branch
These are the people who make the laws. Basically, it’s Congress. Congress is made up of elected representatives from each state (how many there are per state depends on state population), and they toss around ideas for new laws and acts. In its early stages, a law is called a bill, and it has to be ratified by enough members of Congress to become a law. The president has the power to veto bills. That is, prevent them from becoming laws. It really a load of partisan bickering for the most part.

Executive Branch
The president and his/her cabinent. Doubtless you know the president is elected by the people. They oversee both domestic and foreign affairs, and try to keep the administration in the good graces of American citizens and the rest of the world. The presidential cabinent is made up of the vice president, the secretary of state, etc.

All the branches are supposed to adhere to the Constitution, which was created by the founding fathers of America some two hundred thirty years back. The branches are supposed to keep each other in check. If these two things actually happened once in awhile, the country would be much better for it.

Sufficient enough explanation? I’m sure there are some flaws in there, so you American MBers feel free to correct me.

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121

Traggle

in September 25th, 2007 @ 20:06

“Liberalism refers to a broad array of related ideas and theories of government that consider individual liberty to be the most important political goal.[1] Liberalism has its roots in the Western Age of Enlightenment.

Broadly speaking, liberalism emphasizes individual rights and equality of opportunity. “- this was quoted from WIkipedia

“The Liberal Party exists to build a Liberal Society in which every citizen shall possess liberty, property and security, and none shall be enslaved by poverty, ignorance or conformity. Its chief care is for the rights and opportunities of the individual and in all spheres it sets freedom first. “- quoted from Liberal.org

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122

agagabagabag zepata (trevor the decent)

in September 25th, 2007 @ 20:17

And at conservative.orgm they think that socialized healthcare means that everyone has to buy healthcare. l rest my case.

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123

Traggle

in September 25th, 2007 @ 20:29

122- What case? I’m not trying to be mean, but I’m not sure what case that proves.

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124

lifewithoutanipod :(

in September 25th, 2007 @ 20:31

Has anyone here done the political compass test? I just took it and I found out that I’m much more of a hardcore liberal than I thought. I got economic -7.25, social -6.41. That means I’m more liberal than Gandhi and the Dalai Lama.

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125

Traggle

in September 25th, 2007 @ 20:45

I got economic -6.25, and social -5.38. More liberal than Ghandi, about the same as the Dalai Lama.

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126

Robert Coontz (Administrator)

in September 25th, 2007 @ 20:52

Editor’s note: The name is spelled Gandhi, not Ghandi.

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127

Traggle

in September 25th, 2007 @ 20:56

Whoops.

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128

dark duke of darkness

in September 25th, 2007 @ 21:04

im about -7.5, -7.5.
118- i dont think anyone is asking pastors to marry anyone who wants to be. pastors only marry you if you’re christian… what gay rights activists want is for same-sex marriages to be recognized by the government. a justice of the peace marries you, and this is recognized by the government. this is what liberals want. we dont want pastors to d anything against their beliefs. they’re religious. they have(or should have) nothing to do with the government.

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129

agagabagabag zepata (trevor the decent)

in September 25th, 2007 @ 21:28

l didn’t understand the answer, but l’m very liberal.

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130

oxlin widdershins

in September 25th, 2007 @ 22:06

128- yes! I was going to rant about that. exactly! Marriage is a religious institution. Civil unions are govermental (civil that is) and should be for both gay and straight couples. It should be the church/synagogue/mosques decision and the state should allow any two consenting adults to have a civil union and legal rights.

Economically: -6.50; Socially: -5.85

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131

agagabagabag zepata (trevor the decent)

in September 25th, 2007 @ 22:10

But my parents are married and they’re both atheists!

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132

lifewithoutanipod :(

in September 26th, 2007 @ 06:10

131-read it again slowly. People can still be married by the government, but a church marrage is usually for people of that religion. Some atheists are married in churches though.

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133

Lord Arthur of Death's Realm

in September 26th, 2007 @ 17:11

114- that’s interesting up in the frozen north i think it’s the oposite (liberal vs. comservative) note: i said I THINK. because i’m not sure because i failed the government test in gr.5

120- thanks so much.

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134

Shadowkat

in September 26th, 2007 @ 18:31

119-Yes, by my standards, which are rooted in freedom of non-interfering choice and action. And in what, pray tell, are your standards rooted?

121-“The Liberal Party exists to build a Liberal Society in which every citizen shall possess liberty, property and security, and none shall be enslaved by poverty, ignorance or conformity.”
(I don’t like to partially quote, by my only real argument was against this part of this quote, so it’s what I did.)
If their aim is to “free” everyone from poverty and ignorance (I know it also said conformity, but I have no problem with that, depending on the context.), what do you think they mean? As far as I can tell, that means that they want to make sure that everyone gets money, even if they didn’t earn it, and that everyone gets educated, even if they can’t pay a teacher to teach.
I’m sorry, but as cruel as this might sound, that’s not the way it should be. Not, though, because of the ends, but because of the means.

122-Well, technically, (if I understand the terminology correctly) “socialized healthcare” means that everyone has to pay for everyone’s healthcare.

128-And I’m fine with that. But it’s the idea that anyone shouldn’t have a choice as to their non-interfering actions that bothers me, not who’s having their choice made for them.

130-Excellent.

133-Well, honestly, it all depends on your definition of the terms. The term “Liberal” used to mean someone with Libertarian views (and I mean a really long time ago), and then “Liberal”s’ views changed, but they kept the name. Same with “Conservatives”. The name means something different than the user of said name.

Economic: 7.00
Social: -1.85

But you have to admit, there was no “impartial” answer, and the questions were slightly loaded.

Now everyone take the “World’s Smallest Political Quiz”!!!

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135

agagabagabag zepata (trevor the decent)

in September 26th, 2007 @ 18:40

That is a very biased quiz. lt’s on a libertarian site!

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136

Shadowkat

in September 26th, 2007 @ 19:25

135-Well, at least the questions aren’t loaded.

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137

agagabagabag zepata (trevor the decent)

in September 26th, 2007 @ 19:40

Excuse me?

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138

Gwendolyn of the Eastern Seas

in September 26th, 2007 @ 20:12

Gun-toting questions? Wow. Who knew they had such a thing!

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139

dark duke of darkness

in September 26th, 2007 @ 21:29

“they want to make sure that everyone gets money, even if they didn’t earn it, and that everyone gets educated, even if they can’t pay a teacher to teach.” *gazes at ambiguous pronoun reference.*
yep, thats pretty much right. even if people cant or dont, or even wont earn money, they deserve to have it. and *gasp* even if someone’s parents are too poor to pay for a school, they should still be able to go. yes. even if they’re poor, they deserve an education.
“And I’m fine with that. But it’s the idea that anyone shouldn’t have a choice as to their non-interfering actions that bothers me, not who’s having their choice made for them.”-whaaaaaaa?
like i said, no one is making choices for pastors. they are the ones making choices for homosexuals.
i too am a libertarian, but i’m not an anarchist. and yes, i am implying that you are. you seem to be against every form of organized government possible.

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140

dark duke of darkness

in September 26th, 2007 @ 21:34

i took your quiz. appearantely, i’m a liberal. surprise! anyway, its much inferior to the political compass test. the whole idea of that test is that there is not a simple left right scale. you can be libertarian and economically leftist, as can you be authoratarian and economically leftist. that would be stalin. you can also be libertarian and economically right winged. that would be you.

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141

Kagcomix the Special

in September 27th, 2007 @ 17:06

hmmmm…. this is more than i bargained for *thinks up new hot topic*……………… *still thinking*

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142

Shadowkat

in September 27th, 2007 @ 19:19

*leaves HT thread for a while (say, a day or two) until she can cool down, or until the people still on it start talking about something else)

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143

trevor the decent, snarkmaster, resident blog-spy

in October 1st, 2007 @ 22:23

Attention, saiyin!
142- Quitter.
Anyway, this thread is the official home of BGLT, and the museblog GSA. l’m your local straight-but-not-narrow.

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144

Shadowkat

in October 2nd, 2007 @ 19:23

143-Don’t you dare, insult me, mindless robot!!!
*lightning bolts crackle around head and hands, reaching towards trevor the decent [sic]*

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145

trevor the decent, snarkmaster, resident blog-spy

in October 2nd, 2007 @ 19:32

Excuse me? Robot?
*Fends off with katana of crustiness and key lime wakizashi*

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146

Shadowkat

in October 2nd, 2007 @ 19:39

Yes, you called me a quitter, but the thing is, I never quit! I just take some time to collect my thoughts. You, on the other hand, stop thinking, and simply let yourself be controlled by everyone else. Hence, “robot”.

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147

Traggle

in October 2nd, 2007 @ 20:20

146- “You, on the other hand, stop thinking, and simply let yourself be controlled by everyone else. Hence, “robot”.” I’ve never noticed trevor the decent being controlled by anyone else. He alwas seems to say exactly what he believes.

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148

Shadowkat

in October 3rd, 2007 @ 07:55

147-Yes, but is it really what he would believe if he actually thought about these things, or merely a reflection of what everyone around him believes? That is what I’m implying, that he is simply taking what is given to him without a moment’s consideration.

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149

trevor the decent, snarkmaster, resident blog-spy

in October 3rd, 2007 @ 10:10

That’s not true at all! Most of my beliefs are what l’ve figured out for myself! How dare you insult me in such a way! l was kidding when l called you a quitter! And how on earth would you know where my beliefs come from?

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150

Traggle

in October 3rd, 2007 @ 15:24

148- Do you really think a Muser would just go along with the crowd? Just because somebody does not share your beliefs doesn’t mean that they haven’t thought their own beliefs through.

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151

Gwendolyn of the Eastern Seas

in October 3rd, 2007 @ 16:01

Ooo, I sense serious arguing.

Yes, erm… I had a really fantastic topic idea, but I forgot it. Crappola. Uh… wait, I remembered! Warren Jeffs and the Fundamentalist Latter Day Saints! The trial certainly brings a lot of questions in concerning religious freedoms. For those of you who don’t know, he is the leader of a polygamous sect. What does everyone think of polygamy? He’s on trial as an accomplice to rape, for forcing a fourteen-year-old girl to wed her cousin (Ew. Sorry, but I think that’s messed up) and then coercing her into having sex with him.

Opinions?

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152

Robert Coontz (Administrator)

in October 3rd, 2007 @ 16:02

(148, 150) And yet, how reasonable is it to expect complete intellectual independence? At your age, you haven’t had time to be exposed to all the different ideas in the world (nobody has) or to consider each of them on its own merits (something almost nobody really does). So whatever beliefs you hold, they’re likely to be ideas with which you’re familiar. I wonder how many MBers disagree strongly with their parents about religion or politics. If you do, does that make you disloyal? And if you don’t, does that make you a robot?

There’s a hot topic for you.

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153

Shadowkat

in October 3rd, 2007 @ 16:38

149-Alright, then I’m sorry. It’s just that my mom has called me a quitter, and I don’t quit at anything, and that really hurt me! And, also, you say you were kidding…well, that’s fine, but keep in mind that this is the HT thread, and insults (even if not meant) are usually taken seriously here. But, I’m sorry. Please forgive me, and let’s just agree to disagree?

152-Good point, but I think that some parents would support independence. Of course, those could just be mine…

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154

Ebeth

in October 3rd, 2007 @ 17:01

semi-relevant lukewarm topic-how annoying is it when people call themselves “liberal” and “accepting” and then when you go to actually argue something, are so close-minded that they literally don’t even listen to what you’re saying (not any of you, i’m thinking of somebody in my AP gov class). we were debating the two-party system today, and it just really struck me how incredibly close-minded this person was. she seemed to think that other people’s ideas had no merit at all, and while other people were talking, she would shake her head at her friend, and they would make faces and laugh.

after a whlie she started listening, and she listened when i talked, but it still annoyed me. she even did it to people who were basically on her side (that we should keep the two-party system, which i disagree with…)

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155

agagabagabag xarcu zepata

in October 3rd, 2007 @ 22:33

153- Okay then.
GSA, anyone?

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156

Traggle

in October 4th, 2007 @ 15:14

155- Is that really a hot topic? I don’t think anyone here is a homophobe…

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157

Shadowkat

in October 4th, 2007 @ 15:43

154-That vacuums…I can’t stand people like that.

155-Thank you.

156-Nope, not me!

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agagabagabag xarcu zepata

in October 4th, 2007 @ 17:53

156- Saiyan wanted a LGBT thread, and robert suggested we have something like that here.

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Gwendolyn of the Eastern Seas

in October 4th, 2007 @ 19:09

In the words of The Wizard in Wicked, “a man’s called a traitor/ or liberator/ a rich man’s a thief/ or philanthropist/ is one a crusader?/ or ruthless invader?/ it’s all in which label/ is able/ to persist.”
Who you are, what you are is completely dependent on perspective. How we view ourselves and others around us is entirely a selection of choice, a choice that relies on what light we want to see people in. We see facts and opinions paraded before us about everything, so we combine these into a perspective all our own.

At least, that’s what Gwen thinks. But whatever. What does she know?

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160

green faced girl

in October 4th, 2007 @ 19:33

OMG!!! I totally looooooooooooove WICKED!!! What you said about the “who” and”what” you are is really true. Especially for Elphaba. She’s really a wonderful, down to earth person, but the Ozians see her in a different perspective, just because of her skin color.

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Kagcomix the Special

in October 4th, 2007 @ 19:50

GSA…. has anyone read Rainbow boys? it is an excelent book. I myself, consider me to be straight. but i do sometimes question my sexulity. I do, in fact, somewhat love my friend (girl) slightly more than just friends… but i don’t normaly think that way about girls. i do have an explenation that i’m too tired to think of the proper wording for right now.

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oxlin widdershins

in October 4th, 2007 @ 20:02

158- and I seconded it a gazillion times. yeah.

159- YES. And I like wicked too. Though I heard the whole perspectives idea in a discussion on Light in August at a college I was visiting. We are seeing everyone’s (Joe, Lena, Hightower) perspective on what happened and therefore getting closer to the actual truth. Err… yeah. And Elphie’s a dreamer, not down to earth. She wants to make life better for the Animals. She’s a rather INTJish person, really.

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163

Ebeth

in October 4th, 2007 @ 20:45

wicked is a hot topic? woo, something i actually feel like talking about on here!

also e~a, i love how you classify people’s personality types…i can barely even remember what they stand for

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Capricious The Great and Terrible (cappy)

in October 6th, 2007 @ 14:18

146- I have a queer thing about quitting. It’s like… I quit, like I leave a ‘team’ or drop an instrument, but I can never keep myself away, so I’ve never really quit.

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Capricious The Great and Terrible (cappy)

in October 10th, 2007 @ 20:32

Hey, this isn’t a double post, because these posts are at least a day apart!
Anyways,
Do you ever get the feeling that no-one on this planet will ever fully understand you?
If so, what do you think of it? Do you care?
God knows, I DO.

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Andrew

in October 11th, 2007 @ 18:46

165- Yeah, I do, actually. Mostly, I think that everybody thinks this, and everybody is probably right. Nobody will ever fully understand you (you meaning everybody in general). I try to not think about it too much.

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That guy who posts quite a bit (agagabagabag xarcu zepata)

in October 11th, 2007 @ 23:12

The futility of atheism…

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168

Andrew

in October 15th, 2007 @ 15:23

I wonder if everyone’s forgotten about this thread…….I only started posting here a couple days ago, but there’s only been one post since then.

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Dancergirl13

in October 15th, 2007 @ 16:11

165-Ya, I do feel like that sometimes, and I do care. I just wish one person at least would actually understand, its nice when that happens.

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Shadowkat

in October 15th, 2007 @ 20:25

168-No, we haven’t forgotten about it, we’re just waiting for someone to say something with which we disagree strongly enough to argue. (Wow…that was kinda jumbled…lolz.)

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Gwendolyn of the Eastern Seas

in October 15th, 2007 @ 21:17

Nobody ever understands you completely. Not even you. The human psyche is too complex to ever be fully grasped. I resigned myself to that fact long ago.

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the man for aeiou

in October 16th, 2007 @ 17:45

170- I disagrree
171- I argee.

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Shadowkat

in October 16th, 2007 @ 20:19

171-Very true…very true, indeed.

172-Nice…:lol:

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That guy who posts quite a bit (agagabagabag xarcu zepata)

in October 16th, 2007 @ 20:50

Funny thing: Look at this chart of how much l understand certain sexual preferences:
Lesbian: 100%
Bi: 50%
Hetero Girls: 0%

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175

gimanator

in October 16th, 2007 @ 22:51

174-somehow, I doubt you understand lesbian relationships that much. at most…60%

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176

gimanator

in October 16th, 2007 @ 22:52

175-you just posted that knowing that it won’t get moderated ’till tomorrow. how does that make you feel?

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gimanator

in October 16th, 2007 @ 22:52

176-I wish I knew, past-me.

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agagabagabag xarcu zepata

in October 17th, 2007 @ 09:44

175- l meant point of view. Liking girls.
What the-

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179

Shadowkat

in October 17th, 2007 @ 12:08

178-Noooo, really? Wonder why that is…:roll:

giminator-That’s kinda weird.

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180

Red-tailed HAWK

in October 17th, 2007 @ 18:52

*HAck choke* Somehow Heifer got my name and address. What a terrible trick! Stealing people’s money for a cause that doesn’t actually help people! *stomps around room in fit of rage* No, I’m not that dramatic. Anyway, it’s annoying…

Red-tailed HAWK

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181

Red-tailed HAWK GIVE ALICE CHOCOLATE!!!!!

in October 20th, 2007 @ 08:55

This thread is accumulating ghosts, especially at this time of year. *BOO!*

Red-tailed HAWK

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182

Dancergirl13

in October 20th, 2007 @ 20:32

No one has brought up an issue. I dont want to start anything…..

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183

nerdz_r00l

in October 20th, 2007 @ 22:37

I think government should be shrunk, privatizing the public school sytem, and I want to vote for obama if I could.

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184

King Wachtelschlag Fliegender

in October 21st, 2007 @ 13:13

180-Wait, I just missed th
183-Let me give you a hint. “Privatizing the public school system”=CATHOLICIZING the public school system.

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185

nerdz_r00l

in October 21st, 2007 @ 13:22

184-but parents choose to put their kids wherever they want. If they don’t want to put their kids to go to a cathlolic school, they won;’t(btw, I’m an athiest and I go to a christian private school for the acedemics. I find out it doesn’t reall matter if the school is christian or not).

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186

the man for aeiou

in October 21st, 2007 @ 13:45

185- but in most town the private school is cathlolic. also, there is a lot diffenet between a cristian school and a calitlic school btw.

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187

nerdz_r00l

in October 21st, 2007 @ 13:54

186-no, not completely replacing the public schools, but just giving parents vouchers of money to send their kids to a private school if they don;t want to go to public school.

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188

Shadowkat

in October 22nd, 2007 @ 16:00

So have a parent-organized school. A new (or old, if you go far enough back) kind of school.

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189

Kagcomix the Special

in October 23rd, 2007 @ 16:41

my school is only 5 years old, it used to be a school for troubled teens (a.k.a. if you were a bad kid you got sent there) but then they changed it to an arts school. and not all private schools are catholic. there are atleast two in my city that aren’t catholic.

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190

the man for aeiou

in October 23rd, 2007 @ 17:29

189- same here. all I am saying is a lot of towns have none or they cost way too munch.

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191

nerdz_r00l

in October 24th, 2007 @ 00:05

What about health-care? I like the canadian system. I used to live in canda,and I assure you, there was AWESOME healthcare.

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192

Red-tailed HAWK NOW KNOWS THE MEANING OF ANGST!!!

in October 24th, 2007 @ 15:35

The truth of the matter is, people should have choices, we (humans) do not reproduce asexually and so each individual is different. The few choices we have are barely enough. The best thing people who don’t fit in normal school can do is become homeschooled. I think if there was going to be only one type of education, it should be homeschooling, becuase you can exactly match it to your learning style, no?

Speaking of homeschooling (I am homeschooled,) some people seem to fail to remember that public school is a very recent innovation

Hahah, this all reminds me of Animal Farm, which I am reading right now…

Does anyone have any comments on Heifer? I am still *stomping around room*

Red-tailed HAWK

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193

nerdz_r00l

in October 24th, 2007 @ 23:59

192-people who are home-schooled do around 8% better on tests.

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194

Aeiou's Homeboy

in October 25th, 2007 @ 15:30

I, for one am sort of not sure about home schooling. (if i insult anyone who is homeschooled im BEYOND sorry!!!) But, I think that kids should be exposed to more people than their family, because it sharpens their social skills. (not that people who are homeschooled live under rocks) Actually, I know someone who is homeschooled! She’s pretty smart. She’s like…. whoa.

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Shadowkat

in October 26th, 2007 @ 13:40

193-Yeah! We rock!

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196

Shadowkat

in October 26th, 2007 @ 13:44

Didn’t see this post…

194-Actually, we have homeschooling programs that we go to with other homeschoolers, along with extra-curricular activities, so by no means do we only see our family. The ones you see winning spelling/geography bees, and whatever…those are what become the stereotypes…but we’re definitely not all like that. Most of us are perfectly normal. And we’re not all mega-geniuses, either. Just had to say that last part.

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the man for aeiou

in October 26th, 2007 @ 19:40

196- shh! don’t let the secrect out!

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198

Beavo the Online Stalker

in October 26th, 2007 @ 19:51

196-On the other hand, there’s people like my friend Mariah who’s homeschooled, see’s four friends regularly, hates Harry Potter (!) hates any music other than classical (!) and thinks Rap is a Japaneese name (!) and thinks R&B (said Arenbee) is an African country.

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199

Shadowkat

in October 27th, 2007 @ 12:22

198-Well, that’s what we like to call a homeschoolerus shelteredae…

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200

Beavo the Online Stalker

in October 27th, 2007 @ 13:17

199-Woooowwww.

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201

Red-tailed HAWK is shortening his name...

in October 29th, 2007 @ 07:18

I hate Harry Potter and prefer most Classical. I’m not sure how going to school would do anything but hammer in my belief that harry potter is evil (and I don’t just mean the one kid). And I’m not some radical type who thinks it goes against religion or whatever. The entire mess of cutting so many trees down for a book that is making some rich. The recent hp “news” that’s going around the world right now was just that: information let out at timed intervals to get people’s attention and wallets.

The information must be shallow if you can read the entire book overnight. And if there ARE all of these deep meanings, it seems to me you wouldn’t understand them overnight. It’s just a fad–reading it overnight so you can tell your friends the next day.

Speaking of fads, I wondered if we could have a thread for them (I won’t pie people, no )

Red-tailed HAWK

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202

the man for aeiou

in October 29th, 2007 @ 15:40

who reads them overnight? they take 3 days to 5 weeks (3 days- frist books last reading, 5 weeks sixth books first reading)

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203

Raven of the Hawk

in October 29th, 2007 @ 15:46

202- I read the fifth Harry Potter book in one day( I didn’t do anything else that day either…) I don’t look for “deep meanings” in literature, I look for entertainment. But I must admit, the most recent Harry Potter books( parts of 4, all of 5 and 6 and parts of 7) were crap. My theory is that JK Rowling started reading fanfiction to get some of her plot ides

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204

agagabagabag

in November 2nd, 2007 @ 00:13

l think the gay dumbledore thing was just for media.

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205

Cliff Eagle

in November 5th, 2007 @ 16:05

I REFUSE to believe that Dumbledore is gay. JK wants more publicity now that the books are over. She generated the publicity when she was writing the books by off characters. *oh dobby, we misses you so much*

But I’m not hating on JK. She came a long way from writing bedtime stories on napkins at a pub.

Peace love and key lime,
Cliff Eagle

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206

BeMoreAmazed

in November 5th, 2007 @ 16:47

this thread seems ever so slightly dead, but oh well. i’ll talk about school anyways. please nobody get offended.

anyhoo, homeschool seems cool to me in some ways and i know some very intelligent and well-adjusted homeschoolers. but i also know some homeschoolers who are really uncomfortable in social environments, which i think is really bad because the world is rather full of people, and none of us can avoid interacting with them, and i think havig the ability to work well and professionally in a team is vitally important.

but

i hate the public school system with a passion. on so many levels. it offers virtually no opportunity for personal development or accomadtion of alternative learning styles. i doesn’t not encourage students to think and simply prepares us to be parts of a larger, stagnant and bad systemand not think about the consequences of our actions in a larger frame of reference. essentially, it encourages us to be mentally and emotionally childlike for our entire lives. i attend a very highly acclaimed charter prep school, and recently it has been driving me mad. i have between 2 and 4 hours of homeowrk a night, which effectivley means i’m in school for 8 to 10 hours a day. i usually get 5 or 6 hours of sleep a night. i can’t stand it because then i am tired in class and i don’t really pay attention, and on top of that i’m usually finishing the homeowrk for my next class i fell asleep doing the night before. everyone in my grade is like this. i feel incredibly disrespectful to my teachers and that is something i really don’t like to be, because i respect them and am interested in the subjects i am taking. also, although i like my individual courses, i feel as though school as a whole is directed into getting into college, not being a good person or responsible, thinking citizen.

so i think that we need to start thinking about how we can create schools that set kids up to live lives that are truly meaningful for them and that they enjoy. we should revamp our education so less kids turn to homeschool because they feel like there are more options within our public schools.

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207

Cliff Eagle

in November 5th, 2007 @ 17:18

I’d like to apologize to anyone I might offend from this.

Homeschoolers kind of get a little, um, warped. They have no social experience and that will hurt them in the long run. when they go to college they won’t know how to act around people.

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208

the man for aeiou

in November 5th, 2007 @ 17:34

207- we have a sciol life! boo!

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agagabagabag

in November 5th, 2007 @ 17:48

A sciol life? How will a sciol life help you in college?

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BeMoreAmazed

in November 5th, 2007 @ 18:22

it will help you in daily interactions with classmates, roomates, people you work with if you have a job, lab parteners, everybody.

although is is also true that not all homeschoolers have no social life, and not all schoolschoolers have have one.

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211

Prarilius Canix, taking a break from NaNoWriMo

in November 5th, 2007 @ 18:31

210- I’m a public schooler with no social life or desire for one.

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212

emmatheduck

in November 5th, 2007 @ 18:39

207-I hate the stereotype that homeschoolers have no social life, it simply isn’t true. The vast majority of homeschoolers have plenty of friends through homeschooling groups, estracurricular activities, and such. I have been homeschooled my whole life and have never been at all lacking in friends, and none of the many other homeschoolers I have ever talked to suffer from lack of socialization.

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213

Red-tailed HAWK

in November 5th, 2007 @ 18:55

I am homeschooled.

Emma, you are right. We can be social. If it seems we all aren’t it might be because we aren’t sure if you’re about to go off on a rant about us if we happen to “slip up” and admit to the terrible misfortune of being homschooled ( )

Before public school, many people were homschooled, and I doubt the human species would still exist if everyone was antisocial and couldn’t speak.

I find it absolutely a riot when people say “oh, you might not have many best friends”! BEST friends-um, best means the top, how can you have several hundred friends and be able to talk to them all enough to consider them best friends? In school, you should be working for enough time that talking to THREE maybe friends to consider them best, and some others as not-best known friends. I know that was hard to understand, and I’m sorry…

Also a riot is how “socially conscious” you are to point out our “difficulty”. Excuse me? I mean, “you will not succeed” is about as rude as it gets!

Sorry if this seems insulting, but you folks need to realize how rude and uneducated about this issue you are seeming, before you don’t do well in college.

Red-tailed HAWK

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214

agagabagabag

in November 5th, 2007 @ 19:13

Well, l dunno. Schoolschool gives people a chance to learn how people socially interact quite well, and l like to analyze social rankings with peoplewatching.

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Shadowkat

in November 5th, 2007 @ 19:53

211-Lol…an excellent point. There can, frankly, be a lot of drama in a social life. In fact, that kind of a given. But, I don’t mind it.

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BeMoreAmazed

in November 5th, 2007 @ 23:03

ok, so i was looking back at the posts about parties, which i find to be rather interesting, adn this is what i have to say on them (sorry, my politically inclined friends a getting just a bit to edgy for me to want to argue with them at the moment, which means i’m in more of a yakking mood than usual) so.
a) the way i understand the political spectrum is interms of personal (p) and global/national freedoms (g)

so, you can support both (libertarian)
none (statist)
p but not g (liberal)
or g but not p (conservative)

democrats (in the US) usually support personal freedom (gay marriage, abortion, etc and they are less supportive of economic freedoms than conservatives, who favor free trade, etc and are anit abortion and gay marriage. the libertarian party basically supports as small a gov’t as possible, while the green party supports persoonal freedoms and a more regulated ecomony, as well as usually being strongly attached to peace (anti death penalty, war in Iraq) and, obviously, the environment.

as to roberts question about parents… i think you should honor your parents by being a thoughtful, engaged person, whatever place that leads you to.

and some questions of my own…

what should we do about illegal immigration?

should we abolish the death penalty?

what is better, free trade or fair trade?

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217

Red-tailed HAWK

in November 6th, 2007 @ 07:47

203-That’s fine, I have absolutely no problem with that. I have no right to say what you can like. I just can’t understand the people who read it in one day and think they caught some deep meanings. Even if they are there, which I’m not too sure about, reading it in one day is too fast to catch much more than the basic plot.

Sorry the books aren’t as good as before, though!

Red-tailed HAWK

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218

Cliff Eagle

in November 6th, 2007 @ 14:30

Well since everybody s me for my attack on homeschooling I have doubts about doing this but here goes

KEEP THE PENALTY.

People who deserve it have taken an life and they deserve to die.

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219

Beavo the Online Stalker Spy

in November 6th, 2007 @ 16:49

Penalty=bad.

Really. I mean, whoever got the death penalty did something horrid. Duh. But still, aren’t you just making it worse by killing them? It’s like telling someone that they have no more purpose, so they can die. They still have a purpose, even if it’s rotting in jail for the rest of their lives.

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220

Cliff Eagle

in November 6th, 2007 @ 17:25

They have no purpose in this world. If they are insane and cruel enough to take a human life, then they should die. Sorry to quote the bible, but “An eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth.”

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221

Glassboro

in November 6th, 2007 @ 17:43

I hate putting things in perspective, as it depresses me, but everyone has one purpose in life: to have sex and reproduce. Happiness is completely irrelevant. If you kill someone, that’s your choice. However, it’s not in the best interests of the human race to kill someone, as then that person won’t be able to reproduce. The whole point of life is to make future generations, and for them to reproduce etc. If you’re not an Atheist you may disagree with me, I don’t know. I’m just putting my view forth, come what will. Now I have to get myself un-depressed.

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222

agagabagabag

in November 6th, 2007 @ 17:49

220- …and soon the whole world is blind and has to gum their food. lt think that killers deserve to be locked up in jail without ever coming into contact with other people.

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223

BeMoreAmazed

in November 6th, 2007 @ 17:56

does killing killers make us just as bad as them?

do we even have the right to take someone else’s life?

should we try to rehabilitate murderers?

and i think that there is more to life than reproducing.
see,
i think that life is like an onion
and we are peeling back the layers
and somedya we will come to the truest truth.
and in fact, i think that a focus on reproduction is, twistedly, a bad thing to focus on in this time or whatever. the world is pretty full.

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224

Glassboro

in November 6th, 2007 @ 18:03

I don’t think that the human race should be reproducing more, I’m just saying that it’s the whole point of life. Personally, I think that the whole human race should be wiped out based on how they’ve messed up the world. With our fulfillment of the purpose of life we’ve made it impossible for other species to do what they’ve evolved to do, namely reproduce.

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225

Cliff Eagle

in November 6th, 2007 @ 18:11

If I wanted to get in more trouble with my fellow Musers, I’d say that child molesters should get the penalty, too.

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226

greekgurl the Latin speakin geek freak!

in November 6th, 2007 @ 18:26

abite molesti!!! (that means go away you pests [masculine] in Latin) whooo!

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227

Hafiz

in November 6th, 2007 @ 18:31

The only thing violence does is cause more violence.
.
I think that killing people is not right, but it costs less than putting them in jail for their entire life, and you are not going to let them back out onto the street to kill more people are you?

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228

BeMoreAmazed

in November 6th, 2007 @ 19:32

224- do we deserve a chance to make things better first?

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Glassboro

in November 6th, 2007 @ 19:54

Eh, if we can. The problem is that is we last long enough to fix the Earth we could (curse the profanity ban…) mess it up even more. But yes, it would be great if we could fix everything and then become extinct.

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Beavo the Online Stalker Spy

in November 6th, 2007 @ 20:01

223-No, No, and Yes. And if the world is pretty full, you can do two things. A) Kill or steralize innocent people or B) Use and develop technology that will allow Earth hold all these people. I prefer B, personally.

225-They are pretty crappy people, and they do deserve near to the worst, but they do NOT deserve death. I know a whole bunch of people who’ve been molested, and many of them are really close. They mostly have the same view as me.

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agagabagabag

in November 6th, 2007 @ 20:28

The problem with humans is that they’re afraid of death, both of themselves and of each other. They try to prevent death, and refuse to accept it with their religions.

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Cliff Eagle Teh Pwnage

in November 6th, 2007 @ 20:28

Well… i mean child molesters and cereal (heh heh), I mean serial killers should be killed because they don’t need to be here and they do nothing for society but hurt it.

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Beavo the Online Stalker Spy

in November 6th, 2007 @ 20:31

229-Do you honestly think we should all die? I certainly don’t want to die.

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nerdz_r00l

in November 6th, 2007 @ 21:03

226-yay! latin speaker! do you sue ecce romni too? I also learned that phrase!

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BeMoreAmazed

in November 6th, 2007 @ 23:25

if we fixed the world, would we deserve to keep living because we proved we could make things right?

what if a former child molester changed there ways and had a positive impact in society?

can people change that much?

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Glassboro

in November 7th, 2007 @ 06:03

233- Yes, I do honestly think that the whole human race should be wiped out. (My mom doesn’t like me thinking this way, but oh well. I do.) Just look at what we’ve done to the Earth, and tell me otherwise.

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Glassboro

in November 7th, 2007 @ 06:07

235- I think that if we did fix everything it would be perfectly amazing, but to prevent another time like that we really should not survive. Face it, people. Pretty much all of the huge problems, if not all of them, are our fault as a whole. Would you leave our species alive to add even more problems? I wouldn’t.

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Robert Coontz (Administrator)

in November 7th, 2007 @ 11:45

Interestingly, a science writer named Alan Weisman recently published a book about what would happen to Earth if human beings suddenly disappeared. It’s called The World Without Us.

The book has its own website at www. worldwithoutus.com/index2. html .

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Beavo the Online Stalker Spy

in November 7th, 2007 @ 15:38

238-That actually looks interesting. *checks out*

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Beavo the Online Stalker Spy

in November 7th, 2007 @ 15:49

Yes, that’s quite interesting.

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BeMoreAmazed

in November 7th, 2007 @ 17:50

sorry, i know how boring and hypohetical all of this is.
but i can’t help myself.
if we fixed things, would that show that we had changed enough that we wouldn’t mess them up again?

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the man for aeiou

in November 7th, 2007 @ 18:34

238- I have been wanting that book since I heared him on NPR in late june. all copies on hold. *gumble*

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Shadowkat

in November 9th, 2007 @ 16:18

Geez, I had to go pretty far up to see what ya’ll were talking about, but I found it, I think…

I think it really depends on the situation, like, if it’s like, First Degree Murder, then the person has a problem, and probably doesn’t really value life, anyway…but it depends.

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greekgurl the Latin speakin geek freak!

in November 9th, 2007 @ 16:27

imnot even goin to bother looking up the conversation… lalala… someone care to explain?

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nerdz_r00l

in November 9th, 2007 @ 18:58

Anyone here a liberitarian? And sick of republicans and democrats?

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BeMoreAmazed

in November 10th, 2007 @ 00:25

green party!
but i was wondering: who (if you could vote) would you guys places your ballots on for 08? who will win the primaries?

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the man for aeiou

in November 10th, 2007 @ 20:44

246- kokopelli/ craaw.

but really, al gore/ chris dodd.

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nerdz_r00l

in November 11th, 2007 @ 11:27

stephen colbert…

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greekgurl the Latin speakin geek freak!

in November 11th, 2007 @ 11:48

234- OMG! Sextus est semper molestus! Ecce Romani est vexat! (For those of you who do no speak the lingo, that means Sextus is always annoying is Ecce Romani is annoying, Why? becuase it is.) Eugepae!

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nerdz_r00l

in November 12th, 2007 @ 19:16

well…I learned the entire rest of the plot from this!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ecce_romani

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Cliff Eagle Teh Pwnage

in November 13th, 2007 @ 18:38

Well this therd is getting lame, so I have to introduce a new thing. Racial Profiling. Sorry, but I had to.
My cousin got pulled over in Washington State because of the air freshener hanging from his window. Sounds like a DWI, Driving While Indian. See, he had his tribal plates on. and a racist officer decided he wanted to make seregant. African Americans get pulled over all the time in my home city of Boston for no reason. If you know any stories then please share.

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Andrew

in November 13th, 2007 @ 18:59

251- My dad’s friend is a cop, and is under orders to stop any black person driving alone in our neighborhood.

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the man for aeiou

in November 13th, 2007 @ 19:08

252- what the ?

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agagabagabag

in November 14th, 2007 @ 10:11

252- That is just wrong, man.

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BeMoreAmazed

in November 14th, 2007 @ 23:49

yeah, i have to agree. that is super wrong. i don’t think racial profiling is acceptable at anytime. our world is loosing it’s Trust fast enough as it is.

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agagabagabag

in November 15th, 2007 @ 11:43

251- Sure thing. l got a story.
I’m a little more than 1/8 black, (and the same ammount Indian, actually) and my mom’s dad’s side of the family came from New Orleans. The reason they left was because one night, when my great grandpa was coming home from work, there was a big hunt for non-whites, and some white rascist b****** found him and shone a huge light at him. Oddly, he was found just light enough to pass. He ran back home, and the first thing he did the next day was pack up to move to San Fransisco, which is why my family lives in the bay area.

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Cliff Eagle Teh Pwnage

in November 15th, 2007 @ 14:31

256 Yeah, my mom’s from new orleans too and black kids weren’t let into her school. That was changed when a young named Ruby Bridges came in. What tribe are you, by the way?

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agagabagabag

in November 15th, 2007 @ 15:09

The cool thing is that with my genetics, that guy must have been half indian, and half black, and his wife was something and white. l’m not really sure.
As for tribe, that’s something of a problem. You see, my Great Grandpa was ashamed of his racial background (it’s awful, l know, but perhaps he just wanted to avoid more racial profiling) so he told his eight kids that he was Portugese. This was ridiculous, of course, and Five or so of them, including my Grandpa, found out the truth. Recently, my grandpa sent out a swab from the inside of his cheek to a DNA testing place, and hopefullly they’ll tell us what tribe l am.

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agagabagabag

in November 15th, 2007 @ 15:09

Hey, by the way, did the word girl get zapped again in your post?

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oxlin widdershins

in November 15th, 2007 @ 15:33

252- That’s horrible. If I were your dad’s friend I might start stoping *everyone* driving alone. I strongly believe that all people ought to be treated fairly, justly and with respect and that everyone have the same basic rights.

I’m a wee bit Cherokee. Not sure how much though. a rather wee bit.

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Cliff Eagle Teh Pwnage

in November 15th, 2007 @ 15:46

259- yes. It’s something wrong with my computer. From now on I will use grl when I want to talk about you-know-what.

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agagabagabag

in November 15th, 2007 @ 16:29

The only time anyone’s been directly rascist to me was actually fairly recently. He called by a rascist because he thinks that all blacks are rascist against whites. the n00b.

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the man for aeiou

in November 15th, 2007 @ 16:36

262- what the?

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agagabagabag

in November 16th, 2007 @ 20:55

l believe someone wanted to discuss drugs here?

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dark duke of darkness

in November 16th, 2007 @ 22:15

264-sure. whats up?

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agagabagabag

in November 16th, 2007 @ 22:20

It was fortune cell.

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dark duke of darkness

in November 16th, 2007 @ 22:24

ooh rtight. i remember. so. i believe i already stated my view. drugs should be legal, and FDA regulated. drugs are mostly good(hmm, let me clarify. good as in not bad. if you like it, theyre s nto reason not to.) except heroin and other things that kill you. thats bad. yu should only be able to buy VERY small amounts of that stuff.

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agagabagabag

in November 17th, 2007 @ 00:13

Heroine, marijuana, cocaine, etc. cause brain damage. Why should they be legal?

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agagabagabag

in November 17th, 2007 @ 00:26

And now for something completely diffferent:
Barack Obama:

The poor are poor
that is for sure
l will not tax them anymore
l will not- won’t not
tax the poor
l won’t not – will not
anymore!

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Vixen in the Eyes of the Moon

in November 17th, 2007 @ 04:36

268-

reason number 1- people do them anyway
reason number 2- smoking kills people and it is legal.

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Glassboro

in November 17th, 2007 @ 09:07

268- Do your parents ever make decisions for you that they say are for your own good? Then you get all mad at them, and don’t want them to interfere with your life. It’s the same thing with drugs, it’s your own life that you’re destroying if you use them. The government needs to respect that, and just let you decide on your own what to do to your body/mind.

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Beavo (and such)

in November 17th, 2007 @ 10:37

271-So what if they make a decision that’s for your own good? You might be all mad at them, but at least you won’t get hurt. It’s the government’s responsibility to make sure that their citizains don’t get hurt and have the happiest life they can. Smoking can’t be made illigal because lots of the economy would collapse. That would put millions of people out of their homes.

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Kagcomix the Special

in November 17th, 2007 @ 11:10

272- up in canada the sale of cigarets and what not is legal but you can’t smoke inside public buildings such as restaurants. so smoking isn’t illegal it’s just restricted but you’re completely correct about saying if smoking were illegal than the economy whould collapse.

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Beavo (and such)

in November 17th, 2007 @ 11:46

And plus you don’t get immidiate damage from smoking.

And PLUS just because smoking is illigal dosn’t mean that you should make everything else legal.

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agagabagabag

in November 17th, 2007 @ 12:02

270- Well, l don’t think smoking should be legal.

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dark duke of darkness

in November 17th, 2007 @ 12:55

268-check your facts. marijuana is not harmful in any way. at all. period. (except if you smoke it, then it does the same thing smoking anything else does to your lungs, but it is not nearly as bad as tobacco(no tar))
272-the government’s responsibility is NOT “to make sure that their citizains don’t get hurt and have the happiest life they can.” the government has tried that before, with prohibition. that didnt work, and neither does the illegalization of marijuana. about the economy… that may or may not be true, but there is a very large drug ecomony as well. it is simply illegal. and i mean, that is just ridiculous. if there was a business that profited from killing people, and that was legal, illegalizing it would put people out of their homes. doesnt mean it shouldnt be illegalized. however, i think tobbacco should be legal. just pointing out that it is far far worse than marijuana.
another counterexample is alcohol. kills more people than all illegal drugs combined. marijuana has never killed anyone, and is not addictive.

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Beavo (and such)

in November 17th, 2007 @ 13:34

276-You think marijuanna isn’t harmful? You talk to my friend, her mom is a druggie, and used to beat her. Marijuanna is strongly intoxicating. (A.K.A. out of your mind). And it does kill people, but in different ways than poison.

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Beavo (and such)

in November 17th, 2007 @ 13:36

Or my mom, for that matter. I should have her come on here, she was a druggie for, like, twenty five years. Back in the 1960’s. She could tell you about what harm drugs do.

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Cliff Eagle Teh Pwnage

in November 17th, 2007 @ 13:42

is high in protein and Vitamin B.

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agagabagabag

in November 17th, 2007 @ 14:56

276- What? That contradicts everything l know about marijuana.

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the man for aeiou

in November 17th, 2007 @ 15:26

276- there is a business that does porfit from killing people. it is called blackwater, and it is in iraq, and paid for by the U.S. govement. watch the news people.

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Beavo (and such)

in November 17th, 2007 @ 15:35

281-The NEWS? Are you SERIOUS? The news only reports the truth when they do it by accident, dude. C’mon, you’re a muser. You should know that.

Although lots of the Iraq groups that do *ahem* questionable things *ahemtourtureandmurderandkidnappingahem* are paid for by the U.S. Government. Yes. That’s right.

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Robert Coontz (Administrator)

in November 17th, 2007 @ 15:44

Ahem. One of your Administrators is a news editor.

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the man for aeiou

in November 17th, 2007 @ 15:47

282- not that news. PBS, fridays. Bill moyres (sp?) journal. wtach it (but be perpared to be disturbed. the truth is like that.)

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Purple Panda

in November 17th, 2007 @ 15:51

Well there are certain news places that aren’t particularly reliable *coughfoxnewscough*, but the majority of news sources, especially Newspapers, are reliable.

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the man for aeiou

in November 17th, 2007 @ 15:52

283- and we hope that science is helping to spread the konpircy.

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dark duke of darkness

in November 18th, 2007 @ 22:47

277,280-mind if i cite a few sources? hmm wait. actually you do. how about this. ill give you evidence,and say where it comes from. in words, not links.
Tobacco………………………….340,000 – 395,000
Alcohol (excluding crime/accidents)………….125,000+
Drug Overdose (prescription)…………24,000 – 27,000
Drug Overdose (illegal)……………….3,800 – 5,200
Marijuana………………………………………0
*Source: U.S. Government Bureau of Mortality Statistics, 1987
zero people!
“The only clinically significant medical problem is that scientifically linked to marijuana is bronchitis. Like smoking tobacco, the treatment is the same: stop smoking.” Source: Dr. Fred Oerther, M.D.
Coptic study (UCLA), 1981; “There is not yet any conclusive evidence as to whether prolonged use of marijuana causes permanent changes in the nervous system or sustained impairment of brain function and behavior in human beings.”
.” Source: National Academy of Sciences.
Marijuana does not lead to physical dependency. Costa Rican Study, 1980; Jamaican Study, 1975; Nixon Blue Ribbon Report, 1972, et. al.
Most users are moderate consumers who smoke it socially to relax. We now know that 10% of our population have “addictive personalities” and they are neither more nor less likely to overindulge in cannabis than in anything else. On a relative scale, marijuana is less habit forming than either sugar or chocolate but more so than anchovies. Sociologists report a general pattern of marijuana use that peaks in the early adult years, followed by a period of levelling off and then a gradual reduction in use
Source: Psychology Today, Newsweek, et.al.

admittedly some of that is a bit dated, but it does not make it less true.

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Kagcomix the Zombie Stalker

in November 19th, 2007 @ 17:35

283- is that you? or is it another GAPA? mabe one of you amazing administrators could shed some light on these facts.

Q: What are the short-term effects of marijuana use?
A: The short-term effects of marijuana include:
problems with memory and learning (11);

distorted perception (sights, sounds, time, touch) (6);
trouble with thinking and problemsolving (5);
loss of motor coordination; and
increased heart rate.
These effects are even greater when other drugs are mixed with the marijuana; and users do not always know what drugs are given to them.

Q: What are the long-term effects of marijuana use?
A: Findings so far show that regular use of marijuana or THC may play a role in some kinds of cancer and in problems with the respiratory and immune systems.

Cancer
Itâ€™s hard to know for sure whether regular marijuana use causes cancer. But it is known that marijuana contains some of the same, and sometimes even more, of the cancer-causing chemicals found in tobacco smoke. Studies show that someone who smokes five joints per day may be taking in as many cancer-causing chemicals as someone who smokes a full pack of cigarettes every day (15) .

Lungs and airways
People who smoke marijuana often develop the same kinds of breathing problems that cigarette smokers have: coughing and wheezing. They tend to have more chest colds than nonusers. They are also at greater risk of getting lung infections like pneumonia.

Immune system
Animal studies have found that THC can damage the cells and tissues in the body that help protect against disease. When the immune cells are weakened you are more likely to get sick.

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skigrl

in November 25th, 2007 @ 13:51

Smoking is soooooooooooooooo gross! We had to see a video on it last year in sixth grade and they showed us all the gross lungs, brains, and other disgusting body parts none of us would ever ask to see in a million years.

My grandma and two of my aunts used to smoke, but now they finally stopped.

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Beavo (and such)

in November 25th, 2007 @ 14:22

283-Well, okay, there are exeptions. Science is reliable (for the time being :twisted:). I’m talking about major news stations on TV

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nerdz_r00l

in November 27th, 2007 @ 19:40

Anyways… what are you peoples favorite investigative news shows? I like 20/20.

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the man for aeiou

in November 28th, 2007 @ 17:58

bill moyers journal, if that counts. do not know what your mean.

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BeMoreAmazed

in November 28th, 2007 @ 18:27

haha. i heart scource wars. marijuana should be legal. should prostitution?

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Glassboro

in November 28th, 2007 @ 19:16

Yes, it should be legal. It’s her life to live, not the government’s to control.

[Glassboro, I edited this slightly because of how it would have appeared in the Recent Comments column. –Rebecca]

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Fortune Cell

in November 28th, 2007 @ 19:28

293- Absolutely. Outlawing it isn’t working at all, and if it was legal then it could be safer for everyone.

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Rosanne Spector (Administrator)

in November 28th, 2007 @ 19:56

Kagcomix the Zombie Stalker (288) – Yes, Robert is a news editor. He’s one of the editors of the news section of Science magazine. And I am one of sorts as well. I edit Stanford medical school’s magazine, Stanford Medicine. But since the magazine I edit is published by Stanford and not an independent media company, is the stuff in it really news? Or does ownership by Stanford transform it into PR? Just one of those things I ponder instead of actually DOING my job.

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Cliff Eagle Teh Pwnage

in November 28th, 2007 @ 19:57

294- not true usually the pimps abduct them.

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ebeth

in November 28th, 2007 @ 20:02

so i just watched a bit of the republican youtube debate…

can one of the more conservative MBers explain to me what the big deal is with immigration? why do people have such a huge problem with it? people seem to have this arrogant (i think) sense of entitlement, like “we deserve to be here, because we were born! but they don’t, because they just wanted to be here so much that they risked basically everything they had to get here…”

idk, i’m probably misinterpreting the reasoning, but that’s what i see people saying.

and if people are just worried about the illegal bit, why not just open up legal immigration more? to me that seems like the best thing to do…there are problems with it, of course, but it just feels wrong to exclude people from a country whose idealogical basis is freedom and equal opportunity…

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ebeth

in November 28th, 2007 @ 20:13

297-if it were legal, it would be better regulated. bill told me they have legal brothels in some state…i think it might have been wyoming, and she said they were all really happy because they could report crimes and got minimum wage and everything was cleaner and so on

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Cliff Eagle Teh Pwnage

in November 28th, 2007 @ 20:20

As a 1/2 native american, all of us are illegal immigrants.

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ebeth

in November 28th, 2007 @ 20:29

300-like the xkcd comic

go to the archives and look for “national language” unless the GAPA’s would permit a mostly harmless link?

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ebeth

in November 28th, 2007 @ 21:16

I take your silence as a No, O GAPAs. *bows to their will*

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Robert Coontz (Administrator)

in November 28th, 2007 @ 21:45

(301, 302) Such is our will, alas.

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nerdz_r00l

in November 28th, 2007 @ 22:01

anyways…What do people think about those people that went protesting at soldiers funerals with those signs? were they justly banned in 42 states?
I think so, because their picket signs go too far.(god hates fags, god hates america, god hates anal ***, etc.)

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agagabagabag

in November 28th, 2007 @ 22:43

Yeah , they suck.

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Cliff Eagle Teh Pwnage

in November 29th, 2007 @ 14:57

new thread pleaz

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ebeth

in November 29th, 2007 @ 17:04

this is kind of related…but did anybody see the horror writer protest where they went to the studios and performed a fake exorcism? i thought that was funny

also, i was poking around the ap wire this morning, because we were supposed to be researching prezzies, and i already knew what i needed to know for my paper, and i found a story about a british teacher that was arrested in sudan because she let her 7-yr-old students name their class teddy bear “muhammed”. even though it was a common name for men, they said that naming a toy that would be demeaning to their religion. there was a quote from some guy who was like “this is a western plot!” it was pretty ridiculous. i think it said the brits are trying to get her out, and it said the punishment for that is 40 lashes

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Robert Coontz (Administrator)

in November 29th, 2007 @ 17:11

The Sudanese court convicted her of a lesser charge (insulting Islam, instead of inciting religious hatred). So instead of 40 lashes and six months in prison, she gets 15 days in prison and deportation. She’s already served five days during the trial, so she has 10 more days to go. Then she has to leave Sudan.

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Cat's Meow

in November 29th, 2007 @ 18:30

307-Yeah, that was sort of unusual.

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Cliff Eagle Teh Pwnage

in November 29th, 2007 @ 18:48

Its a bit over the top, but in the religion of Islam, you cannot make an image of the prophet Muhammad.

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ebeth

in November 29th, 2007 @ 18:54

308-well that’s good (better, anyway)

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agagabagabag

in November 29th, 2007 @ 19:01

304- Why did you bleep out the way you and all other humans were made and not a harmful racial slur?

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ebeth

in November 29th, 2007 @ 19:38

312-what racial slur? if you’re talking about the word “fags”, that’s a term related to sexual orientation, not race…

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agagabagabag

in November 29th, 2007 @ 20:33

Oh sorry. l didn’t mean racial.

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Beavo (and such)

in November 29th, 2007 @ 21:33

295-And how would legalizing bad stuff make it safer? Just because other bad stuff is legal dosn’t mean everything should be. People murder other people, but does that mean that you should be able to kill anyone you want on a whim? I think smoking should be illigal, but it just can’t happen in the state of the world’s economy right now. Tobacco profits are needed (which is sad).

304-I dunno about God, but if I were him I wouldn’t be to happy with people who ran around proclaiming what I hate.

310-I can understand their reasoning. I wouldn’t want someone to imagine my creator as a teddy bear.

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the man for aeiou

in November 29th, 2007 @ 21:48

315- but muhammed is the person who wrote the koran down. the creator is allah.

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Robert Coontz (Administrator)

in November 29th, 2007 @ 21:50

Actually, scribes wrote it down as Mohammed (also spelled Muhammad) dictated it. Mohammed himself couldn’t write, I believe.

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the man for aeiou

in November 29th, 2007 @ 21:54

317- well, if your Muslim, allah’s wrote it thru muhammed.

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Robert Coontz (Administrator)

in November 29th, 2007 @ 22:00

That’s true. They consider it the word of God, channeled through Mohammed.

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Glassboro

in November 30th, 2007 @ 05:54

315- I found that extremely funny, and now think that I should sell “God” teddy bears. *sigh* The pleasures of being Atheist.

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Glassboro

in November 30th, 2007 @ 06:02

I am so naming the next stuffed animal that I get God. Maybe I’ll get one specially for that.

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Glassboro

in November 30th, 2007 @ 06:04

I have sinned, I know. What do I have to do for triple-posting? There has to be some punishment.

It’ll be like “Hey, you just touched God! BURN!” Or “Hey, wanna see God?”

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agagabagabag

in November 30th, 2007 @ 10:26

Gwahahah. C++D and another atheist swore to god ridiculous things in their science class.

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Kagcomix the Zombie Stalker

in November 30th, 2007 @ 11:36

294- sometimes it’s the only thing they can do to stay alive. i don’t see how making it legal/illegal would make a difference but i think if it were to be made legal then it would stop being and issue. i think that there should me more organizations that help prostitutes get out of prostitution.

301- that’s one of my favorites. because that’s really what people think. honestly people can be so big headed at times.

RE: DRUGS. i know this topic is a while back but i have a remark to make. at my highschool we had an assembly about drugs. instead of screaming that drugs are bad and evil and that you will die. they gave us information on the affects of certain drugs and if you choose to do drugs how to use them with reduced risk. i thought that was smart because doing drugs is a choice and just saying they’re bad isn’t going to change peoples decisions but if you tell people how to do them with reduced risk it can help prevent terrible drug related accidents. how to do drugs with reduced risk: have someone sober with you or if they’ve done whatever you’re doing before with you, drink lots of water but not too much water (you can die of dehidration or of too much water!), eat before hand, know your limits, wear loose clothing, use a vaporizer. there may have been more but i don’t remember.

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325

Firepie287564654

in November 30th, 2007 @ 17:42

Marijuana should be illegal because it can and will kill people

0
0
326

Cliff Eagle Teh Pwnage

in December 1st, 2007 @ 10:57

We need a new HT thread please.

0
0
327

Robert Coontz (Administrator)

in December 1st, 2007 @ 11:09

Indeed we do. I’ll see to it.

0
0

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the man for aeiou

widdershins

Gwendolyn of the Eastern Seas

the man for aeiou

agagabagabag zepata

I, man-gator

the man for aeiou

I, man-gator

the man for aeiou

I, man-gator

widdershins

Shadowkat

Traggle

Lizzie

Capricious The Great and Terrible (cappy)

Kagcomix the Special

Capricious The Great and Terrible (cappy)

Gwendolyn of the Eastern Seas

agagabagabag zepata

Rebecca Lasley (Administrator)

Capricious The Great and Terrible (cappy)

Traggle

agagabagabag zepata

oxlin widdershins

Capricious The Great and Terrible (cappy)

agagabagabag zepata

Ê‘yviva

Unintended Pun

Robert Coontz (Administrator)

Capricious The Great and Terrible (cappy)

Sweet Melpomene

Shadowkat

agagabagabag zepata

Gwendolyn of the Eastern Seas

Capricious The Great and Terrible (cappy)

agagabagabag zepata

Gwendolyn of the Eastern Seas

dark duke of darkness

Kagcomix the Special

I, man-gator

agagabagabag zepata

Shadowkat

Sweet Melpomene

Kagcomix the Special

Fortune Cell

dark duke of darkness

I, man-gator

dark duke of darkness

oxlin widdershins

Robert Coontz (Administrator)

oxlin widdershins

Robert Coontz (Administrator)

oxlin widdershins

Shadowkat

Ebeth The Titleless

I, man-gator

oxlin widdershins

Fortune Cell

I, man-gator

agagabagabag zepata

dark duke of darkness

Fortune Cell

dark duke of darkness

agagabagabag zepata

Unintended Pun

Shadowkat

agagabagabag zepata

Shadowkat

agagabagabag zepata

I, man-gator