Hot Topics, v. 2007.4
For discussions that need to be handled with care. No flaming, please.
Date: April 21, 2007
Categories: Life, The Universe
Comments RSS TrackBack 312 comments
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1
E2MB
in April 21st, 2007 @ 22:06Yes. No flaming. These topics need MORE civility, not LESS.
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Beavo the Great
in April 21st, 2007 @ 22:13Okay, what do we want to talk about?
*first post hopes up*
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E2MB
in April 21st, 2007 @ 22:282 – Sorry to crush them. You were 7 minutes too late.
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dark duke of darkness
in April 21st, 2007 @ 23:40hmm. YAY!!!
*tries to think of a hot topic….*
capital punishment? if yes, then why? if no, then how about life without parole?
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SuperSaiyan424
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 07:084 – capital…punishment? wuzzat? maybe we should talk about the insane amount of homework in today’s schools. i mean, honestly, i have around 3 hours of HW this weekend. that’s gotta be worth talking about.
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Red-tailed HAWK
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 08:26How about how unsocial kids are nowadays?
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Robert Coontz (Administrator)
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 08:31Ötzi requested this thread. I assume she has something in mind.
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SuperSaiyan424
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 08:336 – excuse me? i am not “unsocial”. anyways, the proper word is antisocial. who are you to speak, anyways? you’re a kid too. and don’t tell me that you’re a hawk. that’s ridiculous.
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Jadestone
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 09:478- I don’t think he was calling you unsocial. Besides, the fact that most of us spend several hours on here each day does not speak well for our social abilities. Well, mine anyway.
Capital punishment… I’m mostly agaienst, I suppose. It costs more money on the whole to kill a criminal than to keep them in jail for their entire life. Plus all the court processes, and things they do to make sure the person accused is absolutly guilty.
5- yeah… I have to make a 15 minute movie for biology. We’re at 9 minutes 30 seconds so far; I spent bout 5 solid hours editing yesterday. My eyes hurt. It’s on swans and birds. Today we need to go out and interview people to fill up the rest of the space. I’m just compleatly forsaking all my other homework, now… goodbye A- in history and B in math…
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Shadowkat
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 09:508-I don’t think he was going to…and I don’t think he was necessarily talking about you.
How about…the Real ID Act (not sure if that’s how you refer to it, but…), and what we think of it…is it a good idea? Or not?
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Lizzie
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 10:12I’m against capital punishment; I think that killing people to prove that killing people is wrong accomplishes nothing.
Also there’s that Tolkein quote that goes something like “Many live who deserve death, and some die who deserve life. Can you give it to them?”
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FrigidSymphony
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 11:06Capital punishemtn is bollocks.
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emmatheduck
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 11:299-But this is one of the best places to socialize!
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Dot Keet
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 11:33Unless we find someone who is for capital punishment, this is not going to be a very interesting discussion…
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Julieb
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 11:43I think Otzi wanted to talk about the partial birth abortion act. I’m a pro-choicer and even I think they’re right(on some aspects). Basically, the case bans women from getting abortions at like 8 or 9 months, when the baby could survive on it’s own and they basically kill it outside of the womb. What I don’t agree with is that there is no exeption if the woman’s life is at stake.
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SuperSaiyan424
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 12:43abortion on the whole is just criminal. you have this young life, a soul, a flame burning inside of you waiting to be introduced into the world. would you just kill a being, just because it doesn’t have a name yet? i don’t think so.
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Julieb
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 12:50Oh, please don’t bring up the old abortion debate again. We’ve already done that several times. I think we should limit the discussion specifically to the legality and morality of the act itself, not abortion in general.
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Chickadee
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 12:50I think that abortion is perfectly fine. What do you think is worse, killing a baby who isn’t yet born or having an unwanted baby? How would you feel if your mother WANTED to have an abortion for you and couldn’t? I would feel unwanted and unloved and I would probably go in an orphanage and possibly never get a real home. We already have population problems…
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dark duke of darkness
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 12:5116-eergh. no.you kill a being just because it is nnot human yet. would it be better for a child to be born, and then grw up with a single parent, with not enough money to take care of him/her, and most likely abusing the child because she didnt want it in the first place?
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Chickadee
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 12:54I mean, if a woman accidentally gets pregnant and she can’t take of the child, she shouldn’t have it.
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Chickadee
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 12:59Kids who feel unwanted are the ones who end up killing themselves anyway.
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Chickadee
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 13:06Hey, is anyone still here?
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Sweet Melpomene
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 13:164- LWOP FTW.
Don’t really want to get into the abortion bit… maybe discussion on parenting? LOL, don’t think anyone here is a parent, but we all have them, yes?
I dunno…
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Chickadee
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 13:27parenting? okay…do you think that parents have a right to check their kids’ email? my parents dont, but i have a lot of friends whose parents check theirs.
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Shadowkat
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 14:2717-Technically, he did. And I agree with him. Your point is good, too, though. It’s kind of a tough subject, because no one’s willing to accept what the other has to say, much less abide by it.
23-Huh? What’s “LWOP FTW.”?
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26
emmatheduck
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 15:0124-I think they do have a right to check what their kid is doing on the computer, at least to a certain extent, for safety.
I know my mom checks the history on my computer and occasionally reads MB and things like that, and I’m ok with it. Kids shouldn’t be posting things they don’t want their parents to see anyway, so they shoudln’t mind when their parents do read it.
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Ebeth The Ubiquitous Übër
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 15:3326-i don’t do anything that i would be really embarrassed if my parents saw it, but i still hate it whenever they do stuff like that. I don’t spy on them and they shouldn’t spy on me. And if my parents don’t trust me, (as they obviously wouldn’t if they were going through my emails) why should i trust them? Plus they always want to know about all the inside jokes and stuff (the few times they DO look, which is definitely not often because they know i’d cremate them in an ez-bake oven) and it just takes too long to explain everything.
I don’t like my parents getting into my life in general. They have their lives, and i have mine. Of course they’re part of my life, but they don’t have to be involved in/know about every little detail of it.
i especially hate it when they go all “come talk to me, tell me all about your life” when i’m trying to talk to somebody else or read or do something other than talking to them. michelle and tory and i were talking about this the other day, and they say their moms do that all the time too. it’s like “if i wanted to talk to you right now, i would but i obviously want to read this book/IM these people/watch this movie/whatever right now” you’d think they’d get it. But every time i go downstairs mom wants to talk to me. And the conversations are always so awkard. “So, tell me about your life” “It’s good” “Well that doesn’t tell me anything” “What do you want to know?” “Just about your life!” “What about it?” “I don’t know, just talk to me” “About what?” “Your life!” “What about my life?” It gets so annoying.
anyhoo,
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Ebeth The Ubiquitous Übër
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 15:35that was a at the end there.
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Ebeth The Ubiquitous Übër
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 15:35grrr
[/rant]
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E2MB
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 15:45I have one little request:
NO ONE EVER MENTION ABORTION AGAIN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
It’s seriously getting old.
Let’s talk about MuseBlog’s other famous hot topic: Religions! Squee!
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emmatheduck
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 15:4827-My mom pointed out to me that a lot of te time when kids get in trouble on the internet, the parents say that they trusted their kids and had no idea the kids were doing it. That’s why all parents should check what their kids are doing occasionally as a precaution, just in case. it’s for the best really.
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Glassboro
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 15:5230- Do you want this thread closed? We’ll just bring FrigidSymphony here, and that’s the end of Hot Topics, v. 2007.4. You don’t want that, do you?
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emmatheduck
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 15:52(sorry bout double post, E2MB’s post hasn’t yet appeared when I wrote mine)
30-Religions is much more dangerous a topic than abortions. We already decided to give the religions thread a rest. I think that’s the subect that we really need to avoid, not abortion.
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Ebeth The Ubiquitous Übër
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 15:52Well parents should be aware of what their kids are like, but i don’t think they have to be all paranoid about it. Especially with wonderful chilluns like me
(aren’t i modest?)
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SuperSaiyan424
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 16:19abortion is bad. there. end of argument. next topic.
my mom said that she would check my email occasionally, but i changed my password. why should she have to know what i’m talking with my friends about? i should be able to read her email if she reads mine.
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Julieb
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 17:05On parents: I take a sort of reverse-psychology aproach. I’m very open about my life, so they don’t care. Try explaining every little detail of your day the next time your parents ask how your day was, and they’ll never ask again. Or ask how theirs was, prodding them to reveal more until they ask you to go away. It works for me, though I can’t guarantee it’ll work for anyone else because my parents have very laissez-faire parenting style and are okay if I just answer “fine.”
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chocokoko
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 17:14if my parents ask about my day then i ask about theirs. if they overly prod, i overly prod. kinda the copycat approach
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Shadowkat
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 17:1932-Well, that’s not very nice…
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Red-tailed HAWK
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 18:2413-Of course!
And I wasn’t saying you aren’t social. Just other kids nowadays. That’s why I like MuseBlog; people seem friendly (most of them most of the time).
30-Um, you’re a new GAPA around here? I must have missed that announcement. (i. e. please don’t decide the entire blog needs to stop doing something)
If a child is not wanted, and bearing it endangers the mother, why should the population either go up, or go down because the mother dies?
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Sweet Melpomene
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 18:2624- Not at all. If they should know, someone would tell them.
25- LWOP = Life Without Parole… pronounced “el-whop.” Actual abbreviation. FTW = For The Win, internet expression…
27- I concur. Heh, we have the same sorts of conversations with our parents…
36- Hmm…
Meh… my dad’s a total authoritarian when he’s mad, to be honest. <sarcasm>Isn’t conditional positive reinforcement just wonderful?</sarcasm> He basically doesn’t care what I do, so long as I don’t bother him…And when I do… Anyway, mum’s very reactionary and nosey. Lovely. T_T
But, for whatever reason, they’re finicky about everything I do except when it involves boys. It’s really weird. And the exact opposite for my kid sister.
Honestly, if I ever have kids [v. doubtful] I’d probably let them do whatever, so long as it’s legal. And not pry. Having been annoyed and prodded for whatever all my life, I have an unusually high respect for people’s privacy. I don’t pry, and assume that, if they want to tell me something, they will.
Be that for better or for worse.
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Otzi
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 18:36Otzi’s idea was that we discuss the recent ban on partial birth abortions, whether or not it violates the constitution and NOT how we feel about abortion in general*
*as we’ve been over this thousands of times.
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42
Axa
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 18:58(32) D: C’mon, FS isn’t such a horrible person, he’s just vocal about his opinions!
(41) Please explain to me in detail exactly what that means; I missed that and it sounds ridiculous.
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Donaldo the supercoolio awesome nerd
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 19:2842-Sorry, but FS is. He was the reason the Religions thread closed. He almost started a flame war. He is too vocal about his opinions.
And i have an idea: Let’s talk about ANNA NICOLE SMITH’S DEATH! Ha ha! Just kidding-totally. Please no one talk about it. It is seriously getting old.
What about Virginia Tech? Did anyone hear that the gunman had brain defects and was teased in school?
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Donaldo the supercoolio awesome nerd
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 19:32Ooh! I had another idea. Where should 6th graders go-stay at elementary school or go to junior high? I think they should go to Junior High, because I went to one for 6th grade and it helped me prepare for 7th grade because I had to go to different teachers for the most part, but I had the same english/history teacher and same math/science teacher. Plus, if you are extra smart, like me, you can got to Pre-Algebra, like me. I also think it is OK leaving my friends at elementary school because I made so many new friends at my new school and have met more this year.
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Julieb
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 19:3340- Isn’t it strange that people always grow up determined to be different from their parents. I grow up with cool hippie parents, and end up badgering them about not being strict enough. Ironic, huh?
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Shadowkat
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 19:4640-Thanks.
43-No, he’s not…he can be overly vocal, but that’s one of the reasons I like him so much…he’s not afraid of what anyone thinks, and isn’t afraid to show it. I like him. So there. And there’s a whole thread for the VA Tech shooting…check it.
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Julieb
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 20:06How about this for a new topic: Colony Collapse Disorder, and the new theory that it may be caused by cellphone signals?
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Duncan_Quagmire
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 20:3941: For me, the abortion issue comes down to one central question: What is the unborn?
If the unborn are NOT human, then there is nothing morally wrong with an abortion, and one could argue that it would violate the Constitution to *ban* abortions.
However, if the unborn ARE human (which I hold to be true), then any form of abortion is immoral, and the ban on partial birth abortions does not violate the Constitution but is rather a step towards attaining the “life” and “liberty” promised by the Declaration of Independence.
Discuss…
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E2MB
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 20:5132 – No it isn’t. Hot Topics has a way of spreading the offensive topics around.
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Dot Keet
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 21:0648: Good way to sum it up. I have the same view as you, but I’m only going to talk about the new ban. It IS progress, but I think it is ridiculous that people think they can set a specific time when they are going to start treating the fetus as a child. Is it… when the third trimester starts, on the second? On the millisecond? Or 24 hours give or take? What next, a test to determine someone’s human-ness?
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Robert Coontz (Administrator)
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 22:08Something to think about: does a foetus have to be either 0% human (nonhuman) or 100% human? At different stages of development, might it be 20%, 30%, 60%, 80% human?
Another way of looking at is like a function in mathematics. Before conception, the value of the function is zero (0 on the y axis). After birth, the value is 1. Everyone talks as if the function has to be a step function — that is, it shoots vertically from 0 to 1 at one of those two points. But there are infinitely many ways to connect those points. (Whether it would be possible to base laws on that mathematical approach is something I’m not sure about.)
Just something that occurred to me one day and that I’ve thought about off and on since.
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Otzi
in April 22nd, 2007 @ 23:31Well, I know it’s not OK to base laws off of religion, and that’s what I’ve seen happening here. No exeption for the life or health of the mother! So, if a woman is going to die if she gives birth, they’re going to let her die rather than the foetus? This is wrong on so many levels: Legal, moral, political, constitutional…
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SuperSaiyan424
in April 23rd, 2007 @ 06:39oh yeah. we’ve started discussions on Abortion, Fridgy, Parental Privacy, and HomeWork all in one thread. amazing.
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wingnut
in April 23rd, 2007 @ 08:3653- Seems more like no one can agree on what to discuss.
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Robert Coontz (Administrator)
in April 23rd, 2007 @ 08:41You don’t have to discuss anything. Some of these topics (such as parental privacy and homework) aren’t particularly hot and could be discussed on other threads. “Hot topics” was created for discussions that needed extra-careful handling or that some MBers might want to avoid. If nothing like that is in the air right now, then you can let the thread sit until something comes up.
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E2MB
in April 23rd, 2007 @ 10:33Sounds good.
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FrigidSymphony
in April 23rd, 2007 @ 13:01Don’t worry, I’m proud of it.
Go on, discuss me, it’ll pamper my ego.
Abortion is good. And I don’t care how old a foetus is, the world is overpopulated anyway.
Parents should not have their noses in their childrens business, but if the children are stupid enough to do stupid things, that’s their stupidity.
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Otzi
in April 23rd, 2007 @ 14:37*exasperated* I hardly think that we should discuss Fridge on the Hot Topic thread.
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FrigidSymphony
in April 23rd, 2007 @ 14:43But I am a hot topic. Or at least hot.
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SuperSaiyan424
in April 23rd, 2007 @ 14:51and i hardly think that fridgy is a “hot” topic. *laughs*
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Jadestone
in April 23rd, 2007 @ 16:08*rolls eyes*
Abortion… well, if a parent who is obviosly unable to care for a child decides to go through it and have the child, would the child be better off? Would he/she be raised in a good environment or be orphaned? I believe it should be the mothers choice. The real issue that I’ve observd is when a group of cells with the potential to become a human actually becomes a human.
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johnkerry
in April 23rd, 2007 @ 16:2060- no,probally not
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cHill
in April 23rd, 2007 @ 16:4259,60- On religion, yes. I bet he’s probably pretty nice otherwise though. (I get the pun)
36- I do the same thing! My parents don’t want to know anything more about me!
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Dot Keet
in April 23rd, 2007 @ 18:1859: I have to admit I burst out laughing when I read this. I guess sometimes even extremely egocentric comments can be hilarious. lawl
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Shadowkat
in April 23rd, 2007 @ 18:19Mostly in reply to Fridgey’s statement about over-population:
For goodness’ sakes!!!!! The world is over-populated, so let’s just kill off a few unborn and or unwanted babies who have no say in the matter. In fact, why don’t we kill the elderly? The world is over-populated, and many people don’t want them, anyway. Sure, they might have some say, but, ultimately, they’re a burden on us, so let’s just get rid of them. Look at what you people are saying!!! I think abortion is, for the most part, just a way for the not-quite-mother to say, “Well, I [got] screwed up and ruined my life. I don’t like that, so I think I’ll just ruin the life of the resulting baby to cover my own ass.” It’s disgusting.
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Donaldo the supercoolio awesome nerd
in April 23rd, 2007 @ 19:0465-I totally agree with you on both topics!
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Piggy
in April 23rd, 2007 @ 19:08abortion is cruel murder. that’s what it is. life is one of the miracles in this world. who are we to take it away from a tiny human being? who are we to stop its delicate beating heart? who are we to deny it the most basic right to “life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness”? again i ask you, who are we to kill the defenseless? we frown upon those who murder adult humans, and we despise child murderers, so why does society permit such an evil as abortion? why does society suddenly have the right to allow murder? it’s terrible. simply terrible. i realize that victims of rape might want to have an abortion, but why not choose adoption? then, the child can have a chance to live life to the fullest? how would you like it if your mother had an abortion? what would everyone’s lives be like if you had never been born? how different would the world be? what would the world be like if Abraham Lincoln had never been born? or the Wright brothers? or Ghandi? what would the world be like if you never had a chance to change it? you may think, “i’m just a normal person.” but do you think Abe Lincoln knew he would eventually free the slaves? did the wright brothers know that they would be the ones to achieve the first controlled powered flight in history? you could be the next highly influential person, and so could any of the helpless victims of abortion throughout history.
“All life, from conception and through all subsequent stages, is sacred.” -John Paul II
I’m praying for all of you. especially you, FS and the Dark Duke of Darkness. may you see the holy light of God and respond to His call. I love you all.
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Beavo the Great
in April 23rd, 2007 @ 19:293-
4-LWOP is fine by me, but not Capital Punishment. I think killing is bad either way.
5-Capital Punishment is a way of killing someone for a crime (usually murder) by giving them a lethal shot, electric chair, and there are some other not-nice ways of doing it.
Abortion. Hmmm. I really dont know where I stand on this topic. I guess its wrong to kill someone, but they still cant contribute to socioty when they arent even born. But they could grow up to be a great person. Maybe.
24-My parents totally spy on me. They check my email, websites, and sneak into my room to look for… I dont know what they look for. Other than my haloween candy (which is LONG gone). I know a kid who’s parents installed a camera in his room and BATHROOM. Pervs.
42-Vocal! *scoff* Is that like a nice way of saying insulting-everyone-at-every-chance-he-gets?? But he is a good debator, so I would still like him on the Hot Topics threads. No offence FS.
43-Anna Nicole Smith *giggle cough* lol
44-Junior High (I call it Middle School) because I think 5th grade is when you kind of enter pre-teanism or whatever. In elementary*spelledwrongprobably* you have more guidence aka walking in lines and going everywhere with one teacher. But in Middle, you have more freedom.
51-Hmm. I like that. You can go from like O% human to 100%. I think you can be killed at 30% because you really havent even taken shape yet.
59-
Sorry for randomly posting like a gazzilion answers. I love hot topics.
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dark duke of darkness
in April 23rd, 2007 @ 19:4559-lol.
67- *sigh* tell me this. is it more cruel to kill something that by many definitions is not human, and has about as much understanding of its surroundings as an ant, or condemn that to a horrible life, which will in turn ruin many others’ lives? and when it grows up, it is most certainly human. if a 12 year old girl is raped. and does not have an abortion. it will probably kill her. simple as that. that is the life that is sacred. not the embryo of something with no reasoning power. when a baby is born, and before it it born, it is clueless. nothing in the brain. cannot think like we can. basically, it is inhuman. killing a dog is wrong. but killing a dog for the sake of someone’s life is not wrong. or killing a dog if it would become human in a year, and not have anyone to take care of it. assuming that you’re female, how would you feel if you became pregnant? personally, i dont think you would feel happy for the “delicate beating heart”. i think that you would feel horrible. now, because your parents are strongly against abortion, you would have to have a baby. this would quite simply ruin your life. and the life of the baby would not be so great. eve if it was put up for adoption.
57-you live in europe. overpopulation is hardly a problem……..
51-heh. i dont think the abti abortionist would like reducing a “human being” to a mathematical formula.
43-theres a thread for that.
that was my two bits.
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dark duke of darkness
in April 23rd, 2007 @ 19:51right. now for my parents. they are cool. they arent evil, authoritarian fools like yours. lol. my computer is mine, and mine alone. not touched. and they let me do basically what i want as long as i ask. quite simple really.
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Shadowkat
in April 23rd, 2007 @ 19:5466-Donaldo, I love you…j/k, but, seriously, I’m so glad that there’s finally someone here who agrees with me on most points…it’s very refreshing!
67-Well, I’m an atheist, but you and I still share a few morals, as you can probably tell.
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Julieb
in April 23rd, 2007 @ 20:0467- There are so many children waiting to be adopted, the world really can’t support all the children that would pour in should every woman currently getting an abortion opt to put their baby up for adoption instead. Plus, there’s the whole carrying-the-baby-to-term-and-giving-birth thing that wouldn’t be too pleasant. In addition, the crime rate would probably go up should all formerly aborted fetuses be born, because most likely they would not be well cared for, and as statistics show people who grow up in a “bad” home are more likely to commit crimes. Rapists obviously have something very wrong with them and this could be passed on. Would you like there to be more rapists in the world? You say abortion is murder, but the fetus is not sentient. Can you remember gestation? Do you eat meat? Because that “baby” is just a bunch of cells at the early stage, no more capable of human thought or emotion than a cow. In the end, more good would come from aborting the unwanted fetus and hopefully putting the stem cells to good use. And as for how different the world would be, probably not much. Save for a very small number of people in history, no one makes much of a difference. On the large scale, even the existance of life on earth won’t matter. How do you know that the “people” who would not be born are good? How do you know that it’s not for the better, and that these fetuses would become serial killers or something?
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Shadowkat
in April 23rd, 2007 @ 20:2372-There are also a whole lot of couples waiting to adopt babies…and if there weren’t so many obstacles (I can understand surveys to make sure abuse isn’t in the potentially-adopted child’s future, but there are some things…), then maybe more adopting would be done. My friends’ family has already adopted one child from South Korea, and are trying to adopt two from Liberia, but they’re having serious trouble doing so.
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E2MB
in April 23rd, 2007 @ 20:2767 – YES! Anyone, no matter what their start, can change the world. Who are we to murder the person who just may find the cure for cancer or key to world peace?
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dark duke of darkness
in April 23rd, 2007 @ 20:3372-perzactly.
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Ebeth the Übiquitous Übër
in April 24th, 2007 @ 09:18Still on abortion? I’ve debated this before, i’ll stay out for now
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77
Glassboro
in April 24th, 2007 @ 15:08I didn’t mean to turn this into discussing FS.
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The One of Many Names
in April 24th, 2007 @ 16:11i dunno about hot topics, but the store Hot Topic is rocking. maybe we should talk about exposure of children to gory violence, XXX, and such.
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Piggy
in April 24th, 2007 @ 16:1672- two things:
first, I’m just wondering what religion you are
second, being a rapist is not in someone’s genes. this is immpossible. someone becomes evil through experiences and choices in life. i believe that if i was a person whose mother was raped, being a rapist would be the last thing i would want to be because i would have a better understanding of the cruelty of rape. oh, and anyone could become a serial killer as easily as anyone could become the next Einstein. genes have nothing to do with it.
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80
rabbity24
in April 24th, 2007 @ 17:23about the aboritons: i’ve thought about that soooo much it’s ridiculous!!!!
I think it depends on the situation: if the child is going to grow up in an orphanage or die because it’s parents can’t feed abortion is fine but otherwise it’s the people’s fault so they should live with their choice!
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81
Potato Chip
in April 24th, 2007 @ 17:38I think abortions are necessary in today’s society. I do not think they are morally right, but if I got pregnant without meaning to I would have an abortion.
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82
dark duke of darkness
in April 24th, 2007 @ 18:0379-umm. if ur parents are smart, arent you smart?
80-ummm. i think in most cases its not a choice. if someone chooses to have a child, they almost never have an abortion, unless there is some kind of problem. the thing is when its accidental.
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83
Julieb
in April 24th, 2007 @ 18:0679-
Reform Jew, but I don’t see why that has anything to do with it.Rapists, like most criminals, have been shown to score high on tests designed to measure psychopathic behavior. As you should know, most violent behaviors can be traced to biological abnormalities, many of which can be passed on. Genes control everything. Even intelligence levels are greatly influenced by genetic factors, in addition to outside influence such as socioeconomic factors. I’m sorry to have to tell you this, but everything you feel is just a biochemical reaction. It always boils down to biology, and frankly, rapists are not going to make the best fathers.
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Kiara
in April 24th, 2007 @ 18:30Abortion: bad and wrong unless the mother is going to die if she has the child, and then it’s only considered, not definite. You can’t really accidentally get pregnant, unless you’re raped, high, or stoned. Then, the child can be given to an adoption agency.
Okay, seeing as the topic has been attemted to be changed several times and has as of yet failed to be so, I’ll introduce another topic:
Virginia Tech Shooting. Opinions, thoughts, anything. This abortion thing has happened way to many times, and since I’ve already put my veiws on a former thread, as have many others, I feel that the topic should be something more recent.
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85
Kiara
in April 24th, 2007 @ 18:47Oops, there’s alreaady a thread for that. Never mind.
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Beavo the Great
in April 24th, 2007 @ 19:3882-No because I’m in all these random gifted programs and just got accepted into SEP, but my parents still wont let me have an iPod.
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dark duke of darkness
in April 24th, 2007 @ 19:5484-thats not quite true…all of those can be. or, forgetting to use a condom, condom breaking, ect. etc.
86-LOL has nothing to do with their intelligence if they wont give you an ipod. and i actually agree with them. if you can get into thhose programs,. good for you. not a reason for getting rewarded.
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FrigidSymphony
in April 25th, 2007 @ 12:55Abortion should definitely be available. it’s not killing, it’s taking away a cell before it can develop into something. But isn’t it strange that the same people (exceptions granted) who say how abortion is murder and that we should love all of gods children, even those unborn, are the same people who say we should go to Iraq and fight in the Lords name to spread christianity and democracy? Utter hypocrisy.
Look, first get your christian president to stop killing people, get your christian governors to take away the death penalty, get your bloody church to apologize for all the pagans murdered, and then, maybe then, will you have the moral right to say that abortion is murder. It isn’t. Obliterating a mass of cells is not murder. But apparently 300’000 Iraqis are just fine.
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Duncan_Quagmire
in April 25th, 2007 @ 14:4188: Umm… last I checked, not all Christians support President Bush or the war in Iraq or even the death penalty. However, you CLEARLY know a good deal more about those topics than I do, so I’m probably mistaken.
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Potato Chip
in April 25th, 2007 @ 15:4889- Yes, not all. but a majority.
88- I agree w/ you.
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Duncan_Quagmire
in April 25th, 2007 @ 16:12What are the differences between an unborn child and a toddler? Do you agree with me that they all fall under one of the following four categories?
-Size
-Level of Development
-Environment
-Degree of Dependancy
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Potato Chip
in April 25th, 2007 @ 16:59Unborn children are not concious of the world around them at early stages.
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Duncan_Quagmire
in April 25th, 2007 @ 17:15I would place that under level of development. Besides, people in comas are often not conscious of the world around them. People who are sleeping are not conscious of the world around them.
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Donaldo the supercoolio awesome nerd
in April 25th, 2007 @ 17:2388-FS, for once I agree with you! Abortion should totally be allowed. And those of you who say that it shouldn’t be allowed because you might be killing the guy who can stop pollution or create world peace, well, if the baby can not be taken well care of, then 99% chance they will not find the cure to the common cold or stop global warming or whatever!!!
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Ebeth The Ubiquitous Übër
in April 25th, 2007 @ 17:25Oy. Still on abortion. Jeeshers people. Although GAPA RC, that is an intriguing idea. And one that i kind of am amused by, just by it being so GAPA. Idk why. It’s just very logical/practical/objective/come on people help me out, what’s the word i’m looking for?
Anyhoo.
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Donaldo the supercoolio awesome nerd
in April 25th, 2007 @ 17:2788-I am Christian(as you obviously know) yet you say that Christians are against abortion! And many Christian governors have taken away the death penalty! So quit stereotyping, PLEASE!
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Donaldo the supercoolio awesome nerd
in April 25th, 2007 @ 17:28And so many more Jews died in the Holocaust than the Iraqis in this war!
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Elizabeth
in April 25th, 2007 @ 17:38depending on what stage they are in, unborn children don’t have a developed nervous system, so they would’t feel it if they were aborted, no matter how it was done.
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Duncan_Quagmire
in April 25th, 2007 @ 17:50If I were to poision someone in the sleep while they couldn’t feel it, would that be considered OK?
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Piggy
in April 25th, 2007 @ 18:19in the Bible, it says that John, while he was still in his mother’s womb, lept for joy when Mary, carrying Jesus in her womb, got near. ABORTION IS MURDER!
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E2MB
in April 25th, 2007 @ 18:35100 – Yes, that means that fetuses must have souls! MURDERING A SOUL IS A TREACHEROUS CRIME, PEOPLE!!!!!
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102
Axa
in April 25th, 2007 @ 19:57lol I remember being in my mom’s womb….good times.
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103
Jadestone
in April 25th, 2007 @ 20:15100- How exactly would they know, hoestly? Babies in their mothers womb kick or move a lot.
Besides, how do you even know what the bible says is true?Never mind. Even though I would say that, I don’t want to turn this into a religions debate.
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Julieb
in April 25th, 2007 @ 20:39100- Disregarding the biblical disagreements I have, abortion is usually performed long before a fetus would be able to jump or kick. For my science project last year, I had to grow skin cells. Do you think that those cells had a soul? An embryo isn’t really much more.
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105
Shadowkat
in April 25th, 2007 @ 20:56Alright, well, guys, what about partial birth abortions? By that time, the child is clearly human…can you kill it, then? Because it’s unwanted?
81-So, because you made a mistake, your unborn child is going to pay for it?
Ok, people, I don’t know what analogy to use, here, but look at it this way: often times, abortions are had because the mother made a mistake, and doesn’t want to deal with it. So, what if, every time anyone made a mistake, they killed someone so that they wouldn’t have to deal with it? WE WOULD RUN OUT OF HUMANS ON EARTH!!!!!!!!!!!!! How stupid is that?!
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Julieb
in April 25th, 2007 @ 21:27105- I’ve already said I don’t approve of partial birth abortions. But lets say that, hypothetically, the birth control method a couple was using failed and the woman got pregnant. She’s young, and isn’t ready to start a family. Should she have the baby and ruin her life? It’s not her mistake, but she would have to pay the consequences anyway. Or a teenage girl does something stupid, say under the influence of alchohol. She made a mistake, true, but would you rather she decided to give up her dreams and have the baby? People make mistakes. People drive under the influence and crash their cars. Things happen and people make uncorrectable mistakes. Accidental pregnancy is no longer something women have to live with. Women rarely abort twice. If the young girls learn from their mistakes, don’t you think this might be a good thing? A child completely redirects your priorities. The women who abort obviously aren’t ready to become good mothers. Would you want to grow up and unwanted child?
Everyone who is against abortion seems to think those who are pro choice are anti life and have no empathy. I understand your position, but I see the mother’s position too. She has an established life and ultimately she would have a better life, and the child wouldn’t suffer through a difficult childhood. I don’t approve of infanticide. I believe that early on, before an embryo is capable of feeling pain or any human emotion it is not human. It can become human, but at that point it is not human. Just look at a picture of an embroyo or fetus at an early stage. It looks like a lizard, not a baby. No developed cardiovascular or nervous system. No hands, no feet. A tail. If you saw it without knowing what it was beforehand, you might think it was some kind of monster. I think the difference between people who are for and people who are against abortion lies in their view of this being. Is it human to you?
And the rate of birth is still in excess of death, even with abortions. I don’t think we’re going to go extinct.
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Axa
in April 25th, 2007 @ 23:15This is all so subjective. WE HAVE BEEN OVER THIS. SO. MANY. TIMES. Urgh.
(105) Worst analogy ever. A mistake like “oh noes I missed a math problem” is NOT equivalent to getting pregnant, not wanting your child, sending that child to a life of dubious happiness. Like…what you’re saying doesn’t even make sense.
Being pro-choice is not the same thing as being “pro-abortion”. NO one is pro-abortion. It’s the last thing one should ever have to resort to.
Also, there are so many people in the world.
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Shadowkat
in April 26th, 2007 @ 11:50106-I was a mistake. My mom didn’t mean to get pregnant. She was unmarried, but going through depression…she didn’t think anything would happen…but it did. And you know what? My mom could’ve gotten an abortion. I could’ve never made it past 3 months, or whatever the time-thingie is. I couldn’t have been here, typing this right now. Yet I am…and I am so happy about that. Granted, I wouldn’t have known anything about life, never would’ve known that I existed. But, still, I’d rather be here, than dead. Wouldn’t you?
107-Then why is there such a case for it?
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109
E2MB
in April 26th, 2007 @ 12:17108 – YES!!!!!!!!!! YOU ARE A LIVING EXAMPLE OF WHY PEOPLE SHOULD NOT HAVE ABORTIONS!!!!!!!!!!!!
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110
Julieb
in April 26th, 2007 @ 15:40108- But what about those women who don’t want to keep their children or don’t have the means to do so? Your mother made her choice. Why deny others a choice too? Being pro choice doesn’t mean forcing women to get abortions if they are in a situation when it may be advisable to do so, but to give them the option. Your mother obviously doesn’t fall into the same category as most women who would chose to have an abortion, she kept you.
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Shadowkat
in April 26th, 2007 @ 18:18109-Thanks…I’m glad to be a mascot, now…lol.
110-Well, still, should those children be denied their right to life? I mean, honestly, a lot of orphanages aren’t that bad…and, especially as babies, somebody’s bound to adopt them.
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112
Donaldo the supercoolio awesome nerd
in April 26th, 2007 @ 18:5179-No, you are wrong. Of course being a rapist is not in someone’s genes! But just because a mother raped their child doesn’t mean that they won’t become a rapist! Hitler and Saddam Hussein were both abused by their parents! The Va. Tech gunman was teased by his peers! If the parents do not go through with abortion, they will either have to send the kid to an orphanage(and why would a parent want to do that, parting with their child?) and seriously, if the parents could not take care of the kid, most likely, the child will grow up in a life of hatred and neglect, which will lead them to do terrible things. If they don’t send the child to an orphanage, then, like I said above, the child will have a horrible life, and will probably do horrible things! In the end, they probably would even be taken away by the CPA!
106-EXACTLY!
And I think that abortion should only be a last resort, but that does not mean I am against it.
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113
Donaldo the supercoolio awesome nerd
in April 26th, 2007 @ 18:55I just read your post about you being an uh-oh baby. I also just learned one of my friends was too. Your post really made me sad, because, even though I don’t know you from anywhere, I call you my FRIEND since I have been on MuseBlog. I am sorry. I am going to do research. I will announce my final opinion on the matter when I decide.
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Julieb
in April 26th, 2007 @ 19:31111- Different sources say anywhere between 3000-5000 abortions are performed every day, and over a million occur in any given year. That means a million more babies in the adoption system, and only about 50,000 adopted per year. From a strictly economic standpoint, the deficit is larger than ever and government facilities just don’t have the resources to care for these children. Another way to look at it is that banning abortion would raise the number of woman who try to self abort, which is very dangerous for both the mother and of course the child. I understand how personal this is for you, but you have to realize you didn’t have to suffer through a horrible childhood like most aborted children would have. Your mother (I assume) is happy with her choice.
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115
Margaret
in April 26th, 2007 @ 19:49I am pro-choice. I personally can’t envision myself getting into a situation where I would want to have an abortion, but women deserve a choice, because it’s their lives too. Shadowkat’s mom had her choice, and she made a decision based on her situation and her values, and I don’t think anyone else was qualified to make that decision for her. I personally don’t like the idea of abortions much, but I still think women deserve to make the choice themselves. I recently heard about a girl my age who didn’t tell anyone about her pregnancy, delivered the baby herself, and killed it. I think an abortion would be preferable to that.
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116
E2MB
in April 26th, 2007 @ 19:57114 – Thatza lota murders.
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117
Piggy
in April 26th, 2007 @ 20:28let’s get off abortion for a while. everyone is beginning to contradict themselves. let’s find a new hot topic, and maybe later we can come back to abortion.
new topic:death penalty;
DEATH DOESN’T TEACH PEOPLE A LESSON!
TOO MANY INNOCENT PEOPLE DIE BECAUSE OF CAPITAL PUNISHMENT!
LIFE IN JAIL WOULD GIVE PEOPLE A CHANCE TO THINK ABOUT WHAT THEY’VE DONE AND TRULY BECOME A NEW PERSON!all right, let the arguments begin.
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118
Beavo the Great
in April 26th, 2007 @ 20:32115-Pro Choice? How is abortion a choice? A choice someone makes so someone else can die? I dont call that a choice. The baby is the one who deserves the choice.
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119
E2MB
in April 26th, 2007 @ 21:12118 – Yes that’s true very true.
ALL RIGHT LET’S END THE STUPID ABORTION ARGUMENT ALREADY
Yes let’s rant about the death penalty.
Basically, what I have to say is the same as Piggy’s. We can take the recent example of that guy in January 2006 who was executed when he had changed his life on the death row and had written books on how to help teenagers! And then they give him a lethal injection!?!? What does that teach??? Murder the murderer???
Random: Every wonder why the sterilize the needle for lethal injections?
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120
Donaldo the supercoolio awesome nerd
in April 26th, 2007 @ 22:01I have made my mind up: ABORTION IS BAD. ONE WORD: ADOPTION.
114-That is A LOT of deaths! Think about the war: Three thousand deaths in three years! And we have more abortions a day than that? That is sad! It doesn’t make this war look bad at all! And guess what? Seven thousand people died in the Battle of Normandy(that was a one-day battle), so this can almost be compared to WW2. In fact, it probably should be.
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121
Julieb
in April 26th, 2007 @ 22:16Don’t you think it ironic that the most ardent supporters of a ban on abortion are also anti-birth control?
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122
E2MB
in April 26th, 2007 @ 22:27120 – The deaths of all the abortions that have happened is equivelant to the death of all the people in Califorinia, Oregon, and Washington. It’s sad.
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123
E2MB
in April 26th, 2007 @ 22:28And California is huge. It has 36 million people.
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124
Ebeth The Ubiquitous Übër
in April 27th, 2007 @ 17:52Ok, let’s see if i can break into the neverending abortion deal with a new issue-prom mebbe? We just had a school somewhat near us where a limo driver tipped off the police, who found a whole bunch of cars full of alcohol and drugs. they found over a hundred students who had stuff with them. So for our prom we’re having intense breath tests and the like, car searches, etc. i think it seems a bit overboard, but i understand why they’re being so thorough. (i’m not going, but some of my friends are) I honestly don’t understand what’s so hard about don’t drink and do drugs at prom, but people keep doing it all the time. Peter Ray got kicked out of theater last year because he was caught drunk at prom, and he had the lead.
i think it’s all just pretty stupid. even if you are going to get drunk or high or whatever (which i don’t recommend), why do it at prom where everybody’s watching for it? it makes no sense to me.
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125
Axa
in April 27th, 2007 @ 19:08(119) Tookie Williams? He shot a little girl in the face, and killed her parents, and founded one of the worst gangs in Southern California. Among other atrocities. Don’t think that writing books and “changing your ways” or whatever makes all of that go away, because it doesn’t. I don’t think the death penalty is necessarily the best way to do things, but I’m not afraid to say he got what was coming to him
(124) They think they’re so cool, so “hey let’s do it where most people can see us!” or something. Also, alcohol and drugs waken your inhibition so you can be more loose, or whatever, which is dumb because you shouldn’t need that to have fun.
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126
Shadowkat
in April 27th, 2007 @ 19:48121-I’m not anti-birth control…that’s dumb. And anyway, the only truly reliable birth control is abstinence…my cousin was taking birth control pills when she fooled around with her boyfriend (who is now her ex-husband), but turns out, because she was taking cold medicine at the same time, the cold medicine neutralized the birth control pills. And then her brother went off and got a girl pregnant…luckily, their marriage is lasting…I don’t know about their birth control situation, though. I think this whole thing…like, all the stuff we’ve been talking about (or nearly all) is happening because of a general degeneration of societal morals and standards. I mean, really, if you look at it, that’s the whole problem…and we don’t just need to talk about it…we need to do something. Like, just for example (I’m not saying this is the only thing), stop letting 8-year-olds see PG-13 movies…that might help, a bit. And don’t teach 5-6th-grade boys how to put a condom on in Sex Ed.
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127
Jadestone
in April 27th, 2007 @ 20:35I would say I have probably learned more than I ever needed to know about drugs from unwillingly overhearing the stoners who sit behind me in study hall. Such as how to grow them, funny stories, ect. I try not to listen and turn on my ipod, but they talk so loud. Grr.
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E2MB
in April 27th, 2007 @ 22:07127 – I have to sit in front of a really gross kid for star testing. He makes fart noises and tells really gross stories that I loathe hearing and think about every time I see him.
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129
E2MB
in April 28th, 2007 @ 00:31Belive me, it’s annoying.
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130
FrigidSymphony
in April 28th, 2007 @ 05:27This is disgusting. How is the world going to advance with such idiocy in people’s heads? Yes, on an individual level there are very strong arguments against abortion. But look at the world. The biggest problem is overpopulation. Now, we could bomb Asia, have some natural disasters, or fix everything by having safe abortions possible so that if people mess up with the contraceptives, they don’t need to have a baby. Look at the masses, not the individual. Unless you do that, the world is doomed.
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131
Ötzi
in April 28th, 2007 @ 20:14126: And if you educate schoolkids about that risk, they will know not to take the pill and cold medicine at the same time. Short of some kind of brain control, I highly doubt that abstinence will be universal.
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132
Shadowkat
in April 28th, 2007 @ 20:49130-Well, you know what, frankly, some of those people could move to Texas, or somewhere like that, and I do believe that our over-population problem would be nearly alleviated. I haven’t done the math, but I think that’s a fair guess, considering that studies have shown that you could fit all the people in the world (standing room only) in Texas already…but, of course, it’s just a thought.
131-Yeah, but society is definitely not helping…please, someone explain to me why there is such a case for this!!!
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133
Donaldo the supercoolio awesome nerd
in April 29th, 2007 @ 13:20I am OK with abortion, but only as a last resort-as if there is no orphanages or no one who will take the baby in and the parents are sure they cannot take care of the baby.
126-I agree that the best birth control is abstinence. If you don’t want a baby, don’t have sex! It is disgusting that some people want sex but not babies!
And can we get off of ABORTION?
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134
Donaldo the supercoolio awesome nerd
in April 29th, 2007 @ 13:23126-You are right about that other stuff too! I didn’t even know what a condom was until last year in 6th grade! And I don’t even know how to put one on(not that I would want to). And one kid at my school found a condom out on our soccer field, and threw it at some girls! The human mind is not degrading like Fridgy says-our morals and decency are.
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135
Shadowkat
in April 29th, 2007 @ 13:45134-Ew!!! That’s gross! I would’ve freaked out and kicked it back at them…. And thank you! How old are you?
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136
Beavo the Great
in April 29th, 2007 @ 18:32128-My full sympathy goes out to you. Gross.
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137
E2MB
in April 29th, 2007 @ 18:51134 – Oh that’s so sick.
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138
Beavo the Great
in April 29th, 2007 @ 19:06134-Oh yuck. That is sick. In FLE (family life education) our teacher was like “Ok children, today we are going to learn something new and exciting.” *pulls down a picture of a condem* and we were all like “WTF”???
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139
E2MB
in April 29th, 2007 @ 19:09138 – Holy heck!
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140
Beavo the Great
in April 29th, 2007 @ 19:17139-It was all really disturbing. And heck isnt all that holy. lol
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141
Donaldo the supercoolio awesome nerd
in April 29th, 2007 @ 19:55128-I feel so sorry for you.
135-7th grade and almost 13(my birthday is June 4)
138-That sounds so disturbingIn science, when we studied FLE, our teacher(who is male) was showing us diagrams and cross-sections of body parts and told us how babies are made(literally, how they are made) and last year in sixth grade, we would put questions on slips of paper and turn them into the teacher, so no one knew who’s question was being answered. Someone asked, “Why do we have to learn this stuff?” which was so funny, and another person was like, “How does sex feel?” and our FEMALE teacher said two words: “Really good!” WTF?
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142
E2MB
in April 29th, 2007 @ 20:11141 – They teach that stuff in 6th grade!?!?
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143
Shadowkat
in April 29th, 2007 @ 20:39141-See? SEE?! The teachers aren’t just teaching you how to do it, they’re practically telling you to!!! AAAGGGHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1
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Ötzi
in April 29th, 2007 @ 20:49My school’s stand is “we don’t give a short flying pig’s bottom if you have sex or not, but if you do, we want you to be safe.” That is essentially my standpoint. Learning about sex won’t make you want to run out and have it. It’s just safety.
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E2MB
in April 29th, 2007 @ 21:05141 – Well, I don’t have firsthand experience, but I assume she was being honest. If sex didn’t feel good, the humankind would be in a whole lot of trouble.
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146
E2MB
in April 29th, 2007 @ 21:12I posted the “f” word as an experiment. It was automatically rejected by bots.
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147
Ötzi
in April 29th, 2007 @ 21:20143: Um, no. Actually, they were answering a question. Truthfully, I’d assume. Although I don’t know.
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148
Axa
in April 29th, 2007 @ 21:27(143) Well it is sort of necessary for, you know, reproduction. But no one’s forcing anyone to do anything. They just want you to be safe.
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149
nerdz__r00l
in April 29th, 2007 @ 22:15I didn’t even know what sex actually was until the middle of fifth grade!
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150
E2MB
in April 29th, 2007 @ 22:36blahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblah
I found out in….third grade, was it? I remember I was about to have a younger brother, and I was reading about pregnancy and birth. I wondered how the sperm and egg could get together when they were in two different bodies, so I asked my parents and they told me in private.
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151
E2MB
in April 29th, 2007 @ 22:36Who knew this would be a discussion topic on MuseBlog!
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152
Ötzi
in April 30th, 2007 @ 00:20*laughs*
When I was in the second grade, I heard my sister’s friends talking about it, and so I asked my mom and she gave me a book on reproduction. For a while, I thought babies popped out of books…
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FrigidSymphony
in April 30th, 2007 @ 15:03Sex is the second strongest human urge. It is seen as unclean by many people now due to the 2 millenia long portraying of it as sin by the Church. The pagans revelled in it, they knew it was natural, essential, and pleasurable. Sex should be socially acceptable, not something you whisper about in corners and giggle about. Dammit, it’s what we do! It’s what we’re meant to do! Indulgence granting physical and emotional gratification! Not abstinence, making you suffer and feel guilty when you find yourself thinking things it is natural for you to feel! Dammit, the world is drowning in self-sacrifice for nothing, and no one even notices.
Look, sex is pleasurable, and it is a completely normal act performed by animals and humans (who are actually animals too). If I had a girlfriend, and she felt comfortable about it, I would have sex with her. At 16. Is this shocking? The only reason I’m still a virgin is that I don’t want to have sex with any teenage whore, but I want my body to be kept healthy and to have a certain respect.
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E2MB
in April 30th, 2007 @ 15:19153 – Yes it’s what we do but people like to be decent and so talking about something that involves nakedness is….I dunno……
And by the way, if sex is the second strongest human urge, what’s the strongest?
Handy defenitions: “dammit” means “send _____ to hell!”
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FrigidSymphony
in April 30th, 2007 @ 15:23154: The strongest human urge is that of self-preservation. The second is reproduction, only achieved by sexual desire.
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E2MB
in April 30th, 2007 @ 15:28I read about that once. It was a definition of art. *looks it up*
“Art as I see it is anything that doesn’t grow out of human’s 2 basic intincts – survival and reproduction.”
-Scott McCloud
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Shadowkat
in April 30th, 2007 @ 15:36147,148-Well if you hear that something feels good, does that not make you at least somewhat curious about it, and maybe even want to try it? She could have (and probably should have) said, “Well, it feels nice, but it can hurt sometimes, so you don’t want to do it until you’re absolutely ready.”…or something like that. I know that’s according to my morals, but really…
153-This from the guy who said the world is over-populated…if you can’t take care of the results, don’t do the action.
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RavenHawk
in April 30th, 2007 @ 15:36155- Okaaaaaay. Self-preservation is better than what I thought you wrote at first. I thought you wrote self-perversion
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E2MB
in April 30th, 2007 @ 15:46153 – Okay so you’re pro-having_sex_whenever_the_!@#$%^_you_want_even_if_you’re_a_young_unmarried_teen and you’re pro-abortion_that_kills_innocent_souls_and_is_bad_in_general_because_it’s_murder.
That is just…….
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Sweet Melpomene
in April 30th, 2007 @ 16:52141- Ha, sweet.
144- Melikes that standpoint.
153- I concur completely.
Just wondering, is the ol’ abortion debate…tabled for the moment? Please?
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Shadowkat
in April 30th, 2007 @ 16:56159-That’s what I told him, sort of…only you put your own views into it…
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Shadowkat
in April 30th, 2007 @ 17:47Sorry to double post…
160-Well, if it is, don’t bring t up, again! Oy…
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Beavo the Great
in April 30th, 2007 @ 18:30142-Not just that, and much much more. My teacher who is female put green glitter on two boys hands and red on two girls and then said the glitter represented bactirial and viral STI’s. Then she said for two reds to shake hands, a red and a green to shake hands, and a green and a green to shake hands. The had shaking represented sex, and the color the mixed glitter made represented different STI’s such as AIDS and Herpes. All the people with glitter looked at their hands and the person they just shook hands with and looked very disturbed. We have FLE from 4th grade to 12th. And its all the SAME STUFF!
143-Good point.
145-Even better point! Kind of depressing though.
153-Well, people can be more decent about it, although I aggree with you its “what we do”.
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Sweet Melpomene
in April 30th, 2007 @ 18:40162- Oh, good, this thread should be safe again, then.
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Donaldo the supercoolio awesome nerd
in April 30th, 2007 @ 19:12153-FS, I absolutely agree with you. In fact, in the Bible, God tells Adam and Eve to “be fruitful and multiply.” We are made to have sex and reproduce!!! I just believe that you should not have sex unless you are comfortable with that idea and feel you (and your spouse) are ready for a baby. If you are not ready for a baby, then don’t have sex-that is like a fact of life!
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Donaldo the supercoolio awesome nerd
in April 30th, 2007 @ 19:15Also, I have a sicko teacher at my school who pulls on girls’ bra straps and laughs. He looks at girls’ breasts A LOT and always teases them about how big they are. EEEW! He barely has his teaching credential and should be fired!!!!!
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Duncan_Quagmire
in April 30th, 2007 @ 19:21153: I’m not sure that you can justify the argument that we are “meant” to have sex when, as I understand, you do not believe in a higher power. Saying that we are meant for something implies that someone gave us this meaning.
For example, if I say that “Christopher Columbus had meant to travel to India,” what I am really saying is that some sentient being (ie, Christopher Columbus) consciously intended to perform some sort of action (ie, travel to India).
All this to say that the idea that we were meant to have sex is not consistent with your worldview. You believe there is no higher being; therefore, no higher being intended us to take any sort of action; therefore, we were not “meant” for anything; therefore, we were not “meant” to have sex.
Also, I believe that if humans are viewed simply as animals, then a human’s life is no longer seen as valuable, and when a human’s life is no longer seen as valuable, we get hate, poverty, manipulation, persecution, Virginia Tech, Columbine, etc…
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Shadowkat
in April 30th, 2007 @ 19:51165,166-Lol…notice you said “(and your spouse)”, not and your bf/gf…
Wtf?! That’s not right…I’m serious…has no one told on him?
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E2MB
in April 30th, 2007 @ 20:06166 – Depending on the circumstances, that could qualify as sexual harrasment. Find out more, and maybe he will be fired!
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Beavo the Great
in April 30th, 2007 @ 20:09166-Eww. He pulls on their bra strap?? Some kid pulled my friends bra strap and she slapped him so hard a teacher heard it and sent both of them to the dean. Then he was suspended for “Sexual Harassment”. One other guy was stalking this girl and staring at her breasts and one day he pulled her bra strap… and her bra came off! Then he ran around the school with it over his head like a flag. It was gross, and he got suspended too.
Why are we talking about gross teachers and friends?
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E2MB
in April 30th, 2007 @ 20:19170 – That is so retarded the boy should be locked up in a looney cell.
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Ötzi
in April 30th, 2007 @ 21:22Low cut shirts are not your friends.
Especially in Latin America.
Especially if you are blond.
“Rubia, rubia, que boniiiiiiiiitaaaaa” Ugh.
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FrigidSymphony
in May 1st, 2007 @ 06:13We are ‘meant’ to do it because we are animals with natural urges, also called instinct. You’re just playing with words, trying to find some way to strike back. Humans are animals. We are primates and share physiological sembiances with monkeys, for example. And how does us being animals degrade our lives’ values? Would you kill your dog? And anyway, it seems to me that the most violence-filled years were the 2000 years spanning the Age of Pisces, which began with the birth of Jesus (whose sign is a fish- pisces) and ended at the turn of the second millenium. The period in human history with most bloodshed is the period that was dominated by dogma teaching higher power and claiming that we were special, chosen people. Inconsistent, man.
Contraceptives are safe. The fail rate is very, very small. If me and my girlfriend wanted to have sex, for whatever reason, and didn’t want to have a child, then there are many different ways. Condoms, diaphragms, morning after pill… And if you want to kill your annoying teenage son, the wonderful “16-years-after pill”, also known as retroactive abortion (joke).
As for pulling on bra straps…
I use it occasionally as a flirting technique. But what you seem to be describing here is just immature.
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Beavo the Great
in May 1st, 2007 @ 16:33173-Well duh its immature! But for flirting? My friend says when her bra strap is pulled it hurts. If you want someone to go out with you, would you hit them with a rubber band?? lol I like the retroactive abortion joke though!
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Jadestone
in May 1st, 2007 @ 17:00166- A teacher at our school was fired for that. It’s sexual harassment. Inform him of this and he’ll likely stop.
173- Hahaha
174- It can hurt
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Julieb
in May 1st, 2007 @ 17:41163- At my school, somehow a religiously affiliated group was allowed to lecture in the health classes and as a demonstration of the risk of STDs they asked students to share chewing gum. These [idiot] kids would chew the gum, and then hand the ALREADY CHEWED piece to the next person. Ewww. During flu season, no less. The group got in big trouble though, I don’t think they’ll be back.
171- Please do not use retarded as an insult. “Retarded” means underdeveloped or slow to develop. Using “retarded” as an insult 1. Doesn’t make sense 2. Is extremely insulting to those who do have mental retardation. Sorry for lecturing, but when you do know people who are mentally retarded those sorts of things bother you.
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Donaldo the supercoolio awesome nerd
in May 2nd, 2007 @ 00:15173-You think we are ‘meant’ to have sex. I have no objection to that. As I said before, God tells Adam and Eve in the Bible to “be fruitful and multiply” aka have sex and make babies. But seriously, that is not a person’s goal in life. A Christian’s goal in life, as stated in the Bible, is to spread God’s love and His Word. That is one of my goals, but another one of my goals is to become a famous, nationally bestselling author, maybe even internationally. So when you say ‘meant’ I understand what you mean, but the way you say is that it sounds like that should be a human’s goal in life, which it isn’t for most people.
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FrigidSymphony
in May 2nd, 2007 @ 14:26Of course we’re not supposed to go around having sex with everyone we meet! But our bodies are compatible, and we have sexual urges.
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Sweet Melpomene
in May 2nd, 2007 @ 15:06166- What? And they let him? Dude, stick up for them or something or like report the pedo…
167- Fact is, we’d die out without it, and is it not natural for any animal to wish to continue the existence of its species? Furthermore, you say that you “believe that if humans are viewed simply as animals, then a human’s life is no longer seen as valuable.” I could take this one of two directions: (1) it does nothing of the sort, merely deflates our massive collective ego and puts things in perspective, and (2) are you implying that the lives of animals are not valuable?! I strongly object.
170- Slap them for me, will you? Ugh!
173- *agrees and laughs at retroactive abortion joke*
176- That is absolutely disgusting. And the kids didn’t refuse? Challenge authority, kids! Seriously, take a look at Milgram’s work…
177- I think that he means that reproduction is [do forgive the Freudian clichés] any human’s innate, biologically programmed, subconsciously repressed goal in life. Seriously, how many persons do you know who want to “grow up, get married, and start a family?” The vast majority of the people you know, I’d say, judging from personal experience. Even if this whole being traditionally wed deal is holy, promoted by “God,” or whatever people are calling it, the fact remains that our animal nature pushes for us to seek pleasure and reproduce, while our socially conscious side prevents us from doing so wildly and in a detrimental manner. On the whole.
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FrigidSymphony
in May 2nd, 2007 @ 15:21And, our social consciousness is only conditioned by certain doctrines that have held fast on the western world for 2000 years. Pre-christian society was a lot more open about it, and sex was actually glorified, as the intensity of thought and emotion reached by orgasm is otherwise unachievable. In fact, a man was spiritually incomplete unless he had sex, uniting himself with his other half, in a dualistic point of view, and reaching an elated mental state. Practitioners of some eastern spiritualities have claimed that Nirvana is the same as the orgasm.
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Robert Coontz (Administrator)
in May 2nd, 2007 @ 15:31I’m not a historian (Larry Gonick would know more about this than I do), but I suspect that pre-Christian societies varied a lot. In ancient Greece, for example, women were restricted about as severely as they are nowadays in Saudi Arabia. And the ancient Hebrews stoned men and women alike for unchastity. I’d be wary of looking backward to a Golden Age of any sort.
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182
Duncan_Quagmire
in May 2nd, 2007 @ 18:41179: I never disagreed with his statement; I just pointed out what I believe to be an inconsistency in his worldview.
And tell me, have you ever killed an ant? If so, you basically saw that ant’s life as unvaluable.
I have reservations about bringing this topic up, as I believe that it wasmishandled when it was previously brought up on religion threads or hot topic threads; however, I belive it makes a point and it is more relevant to this discussion.
Yesterday in German III, we watched a segment of a Nazi propaganda film entitled (I believe) “Die Ewige Jude.” In this film, the Jewish are literally portrayed as vermin, juxtaposing clips of Jewish people with clips of rats. It equates the migration of the Jews from the Middle East to the spread of disease-carrying rats. The film is basically mind poison, and the murder of approximately six million Jews (along with five million other “subhumans,” I mmight add) shows us that many people bought into these beliefs.
Another work that demonstrates my point is “A Modest Proposal…” by Jonathan Swift (if want to read it, you can just goole the title; the text is available online for free). In it, the speaker makes a case for slaughtering the babies of 1700s Ireland. Throughout the proposal, these children are constantly referred to as if they are pigs, calling the children a “breed,” their bodies “carcasses,” and their taste “most delicious.”
I firmly believe that people are the most valuable things on this earth today and that there is some sort of dignity to human life and love friendships and laughter and tears and pain and joy and despair and hope. And when people are dehumanized, we rob them of this dignity, this humanity (hence the word “dehumanized”).
I don’t know what I can do to convince you of this. Maybe I never can. Maybe you could win every time in a battle of logic, but I believe that there are some things that transcend logic in a way I don’t fully understand. I know you probably won’t buy a word I just said, but I ask that you would please just wrestle with it for a while.
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Donaldo the supercoolio awesome nerd
in May 2nd, 2007 @ 19:12177-EXACTLY! Most people do not get that. They believe that we are not meant to have sex, we are meant to do whatever we choose to be. But it is our subconscious goal to reproduce.
181-THANK YOU!
180-No! That is not true! The Christian church did not demonize sex. You know that Adam and Eve, “be fruitful and multiply” thing I have been saying? I learned about that at Christian camp! Besides, the medieval Church was ruled by corrupt people! They believed that since Jesus never had sex, that we shouldn’t either! THe truth is, Jesus was not born with those subconscious sexual urges. He never had a sexual desire for anyone(I do not believe “The Da Vinci Code” speaks the truth, just so you know) And even if they weren’t corrupt, they would still argue against sex-BEFORE MARRIAGE! Which they argued against even when though they were corrupt. That is not even accepted in today’s society, so that was OK.182-I kinda sorta agree with you. Humans are probably the most valuable creatures on Earth-my God thinks so, which is why he sent His Son to die for me. We have personalities, we show love for each other, we show hatred for others of our own species, we are intellectual, and we are so much more that makes us so unique(which is why I believe evolution is a LIE!). Animals also have value too, though. There is an in-between to this argument. Vegetarians believe animals are wonderful creatures that deserve lives, but I know there are probably some vegetarians that have killed ants and spiders and mosquitoes before. The thing is, ants and spiders and even fish do not have a very advanced body. If you were a fish, your main thoughts would probably be like this:Swim. Hunt. Eat. Swim. Rest. Swim. They would not be more advance than that. So, even though many animals are not valuable, many others are. Dogs and horses and cats and dolphins and rats and even some reptiles and amphibians have sexual desires, they hate others of their species, they love their family, they will not leave behind their friends, just like humans. So even though you may say killing ants shows that you believe animals are invaluable, ants are not like they are in CGI movies. They do not have many thoughts. Dragonflies only live a couple days. They couldn’t care if they die. They are not like humans and some other creatures, who mourn for the dead. But many animals do do that, like the ones I said earlier-dogs, cats, wolves, dolphins, whales, turtles. So, in conclusion, I will say that there is a line between animals with emotions and animals without them that we just need to understand.
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Oj533
in May 2nd, 2007 @ 19:2982-if we are the most imporend thing on this earth we have abused the privlidge
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Robert Coontz (Administrator)
in May 2nd, 2007 @ 20:03(182) DQ,
I don’t think there’s such a word as “unvaluable.” You probably meant “valueless” or “worthless.”
(183) Donaldo,
“Invaluable” doesn’t mean “having no value.” It means “having infinite value” — something so valuable that you cann’t do without it.
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Duncan_Quagmire
in May 2nd, 2007 @ 20:10185: Shakespeare made up words; why can’t we?
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Beavo the Great
in May 2nd, 2007 @ 20:14179-They’ve already gotten slapped silly. Their faces are probably permanantly red, but both of them moved two months ago. Or maybe it was two weeks ago…
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Donaldo the supercoolio awesome nerd
in May 2nd, 2007 @ 22:39185-Thanks for the correction. I meant worthless then.
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FrigidSymphony
in May 3rd, 2007 @ 10:12Robert, right. Sorry, I was thinking of central-northern pre-christian europe.
The Christian Church did not demonize sex?? Do you even know the Seven Sins?? Do you know anything at all about your religion? Jesus was a historical figure, a person, a MAN. And of course he had sexual urges. The dogma stating that he was divine was established by a bunch of Bishops in the Concilio di Nicea, who, after sorting through all the options, decided that having a divine being with no humanity suited them best. Anyone else was labelled a heretic, for example Arianists.
The medieval church was ruled by corrupt people? The Church was founded by corrupt people. Christianity was first implemented officialy by corrupt people. The official dogma was drawn up by opinionated, biased people, seeking no more than political power. The reason the Church demonized sex (and it did, look up your history) where various: first, since sexual urges where right at the top of man’s natural urges, what better way to ensure everyone’s obediance than by making it a sin? So, the person who finds himself feeling guilty for something perfectly normal will have to turn to the church, maybe with a financial offering as well, and be cleansed of sin. So he can go out and sin again… Brilliant. The second reason is that since sex was held in such high regard by many pre-christian cultures (not all though, and even if sex was held in high regard, not necessarily the women, too), the Church labelled everything non-christian ‘demonic’, including sex.There is much that makes us unique, as is there much that makes other animals unique. We are not the oldest beings on the planet, nor will we be the last, and it is presumptuous of us to think so. Evolution is so far the only rational and logical explanation for our being. Live with it.
Curiously, there is an astrological significance to our times… The period from year 0 to year 2000 was the astrological period of Pisces, fish (incidentally the sign of Jesus as well), in which man (and this is the astrological explanation) would follow wisdoms imposed on him by others. We are now entering the age of Aquarius, the water bringer, in which man learns to think for himself. That’s not the full astrological definition, but the gist of it.
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FrigidSymphony
in May 4th, 2007 @ 14:36What, no one answers?
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E2MB
in May 4th, 2007 @ 15:29*leaves before he starts a flame war with FS*
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FrigidSymphony
in May 4th, 2007 @ 15:34Hahaha.
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E2MB
in May 4th, 2007 @ 15:51I WAS SERIOUS!!!
*leaves before he starts a really big flame war with FS*
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Prarilius Canix
in May 4th, 2007 @ 16:59The astrological thing is interesting. What is the next age supposed to be?
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Donaldo the supercoolio awesome nerd
in May 4th, 2007 @ 18:56189-YOU DO NOT KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT MY RELIGION SO SHUT UP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! THEY DEMONIZED SEX BECAUSE THEY WERE CORRUPT AND WRONG! HOWEVER, MANY CHRISTIANS STILL DID IT BECAUSE THEY WERE NOT STUPID AND DID NOT HAVE A DEATH WISH TO GO EXTINCT!!!!!!!!!!!!(BTW, I am not Catholic!) NO, CHRISTIANITY WAS NOT FOUNDED BY CORRUPT PEOPLE BECAUSE CHRISTIANITY WAS FOUNDED BY JESUS, WHO NEVER SINNED!!!!!!!!!!! JESUS DID NOT HAVE SEXUAL URGES, BECAUSE HE WAS PART GOD, AND WAS NOT CREATED TO HAVE THEM!!!!!!!
SURE, EVOLUTION IS RATIONAL, BUT NOT EVERYTHING THAT IS REAL IS RATIONAL!!!!!! PEOPLE DID NOT BELIEVE THE EARTH WAS ROUND-THEY FOUND IT AN IRRATIONAL STATEMENT, YET IT WAS!!!! THE BELIEF THAT JESUS WAS DIVINE WAS CREATED BY HIS DISCIPLES!!!!! NOT BY YOUR STUPID PRIESTS, SO SHUT UP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! YOU DO NOT KNOW ANYTHING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! AND THE PISCES THING, THE GREEK LETTER THAT BEGAN JESUS, WAS THE SAME AS FISH, SO DON’T USE THAT AS SOME SIMILE!!!!! AND THE RENAISSANCE WAS DURING THE AGE OF PISCES IN WHICH PEOPLE BEGAN TO THINK FOR THEMSELVES SO THAT IS NOT TRUE! WORST ANALOGY EVER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! SHUT UP!!!! THE BIBLE SAYS TO HAVE SEX!!!! THE CHURCH WAS RULED BY CORRUPT PEOPLE, NOT STARTED BY THEM!!!!! DO YOU EVEN READ MY FULL POSTS? I’VE SAID MULTIPLE TIMES-THE BIBLE SAYS TO HAVE SEX!!!!! SO THAT PROVES THAT THE CHURCH WAS CORRUPT, BUT NOT THE PEOPLE WHO STARTED IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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E2MB
in May 4th, 2007 @ 19:28195 – *whistles* Strong argument. Good one too. Though I see now that Hot Topics v. 2007.4 has turned into Religions! Taa-daa! (Though that was inevitable after FS was deprived of a place to rant about the [sarcasm] horrible awful evils of Christianity. [/sarcasm] )
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Duncan_Quagmire
in May 4th, 2007 @ 21:56195: I’m sorry to say that your post is not very helpful if you were hoping to communicate what following Christ is about.
For future reference, I suggest by not typing in all caps or bold, not using a few dozen exclamation points, not telling anyone to shut up, and not telling anyone that they know nothing.
FrigidSymphony is not your enemy. No one here is your enemy. I remember reading somewhere that our “struggle is not against flesh and blood.” I suppose I can’t be entirely sure, but I assume that FrigidSymphony is made of flesh and blood. Disagree with his beliefs and ideas all you want, but you have NO right to talk to him the in way you just did.
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Donaldo the supercoolio awesome nerd
in May 4th, 2007 @ 23:36196-You are right. This has turned into a Religions thread. I knew it would happen someday.
197-No, I was not trying to explain what following Christ is like, but he has NO RIGHT TO TALK TO ME IN THE WAY HE DID TO ME, calling me a MORON and saying I don’t know a single thing about my religion! He has driven me over the top. He had not right to talk to me like he did in his other posts. He had no right to call me and other Christian MBers morons and turn the religions thread into his own personal boxing ring. He had no right for any of that stuff, plus more! Yet he did it, but now it is my turn. He knows nothing about my religion. If he knew about my religion, he would not call it brainwash and evil. He would know Christians were peaceful and loving. I want him to shut up because he is feeding everyone else lies, and is trying to indoctrinate every MBer. If I did not write in all caps and put multiple exclamation marks, he would have not read it all or skipped over it entirely, believeing it was dogmatic and stupid. I figure if I make it big, he will realize how important it is, and that he has taken his ferocity and opinions WAY TOO FAR!
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Duncan_Quagmire
in May 5th, 2007 @ 09:17Maybe he DID have no right to talk to you that way, but you claim to live according to a higher standard.
And I hate to break it to you, but writing it in all caps and using multiple exclamation points actually causes people to take you LESS seriously.
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Julieb
in May 5th, 2007 @ 09:52195- Donaldo, I must say I have to agree with DQ. Writing in all capitols, using gratutious punctuation, and telling FS multiple times to “shut up” really does nothing to vindicate your religion (as in, prove you actually have rational arguments to back up everything you’re trying to say.)
Just warning you, there are a couple of holes in your argument and I’m sure FS will pull you up on them. Christianity, as a religion, was not founded until after Jesus had died. And the whole people-thought-the-earth-being-round-as-irrational is completely unsubstantiated. You’d have to go pretty far back in history to find an intellectual who wouldn’t tell you the earth was round. I mean, past the ancient greek philosophers. By the 13 century at the very least, it was a pretty much accepted that the earth was round. The whole Cristopher Columbus thing is apocryphal.
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Lizzie
in May 5th, 2007 @ 10:01199 – thank you, thank you, thank you for being rational and realistic and refusing to stoop to petty name calling, etc…
yeah, I usually just skip over flames (all caps, multiple !, etc) because they’re too painful to read and don’t say anything worthwhile.
173- ick, pulling on bra straps is not cool. It’s hard enough to get them to stay in place without slipping, getting too loose, etc, without people tugging on them..
179 – just curious, why do people continue to use Freud’s ideas, etc, when nearly all of them have been proven wrong?
Personally, I don’t think that we’re “meant” to have sex; I think that it’s a natural urge rooted in biology, but I don’t think that’s our sole purpose in life, or whatever.. yes, from a biologically-minded standpoint it is (well, that and survival), but for one thing, as DQ said, I don’t think there’s a higher power saying “go and reproduce,” and I think that it shouldn’t be our sole aim in life..
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E2MB
in May 5th, 2007 @ 11:11198 – He’s not Christian so he calls people names and posts all that c**p. We Christians don’t do that sort of thing! Let us calmly answer him in the sweetest possible way, and then his ranting-until-he’s-blue will make him look silly!
199 – It made me take him more seriously, actually. I pay more attention when people blow up.
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E2MB
in May 5th, 2007 @ 11:15198 – Ironically he says the same thing about us.
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Someone who can't think of a good name that isn't extremely siilar to his/her usual one/ emmatheduck
in May 5th, 2007 @ 11:37202-I don’t think that’s quite fair. I have seen a lot of Christians being mean to others, and a lot of non-Christians are nice. FS is a jerk, but it’s not just because he’s not Christian.
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E2MB
in May 5th, 2007 @ 11:51204 – Christians aren’t perfect. Nobody is. We just try to be nice as much as we can, because nobody can be nice all the time.
Also, the US is going through a period of spiritual abandonment right now. Some kids whose parents are Christians go to churches when they are kids, classify themselves as Christians, but don’t pay attention and don’t go to church when they grow up.
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Julieb
in May 5th, 2007 @ 12:45205-Well, maybe thats a good thing. I’ve always wondered what the world would be like if everyone could make an informed decision of what religion they want to be at the age of, lets say, 15.
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emmatheduck
in May 5th, 2007 @ 15:03205-i’m not saying that anyone is or should be perfect. i’m just saying that I don’t agree with what you said, which seemed to imply that Christians are nicer than non-Christians. I have known plenty of Christians who aren’t nice at all, and many, many non-Christians who are nice. It’s good that you try to be nice to people, but not all Christians do.
Wow. I never thought I’d come this close to defending FS.
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Donaldo the supercoolio awesome nerd
in May 5th, 2007 @ 19:02206-Yeah, I have thought about that too.
205-You are so right. Christians try to be like Jesus as well as they can, but that is impossible because when Adam and Eve ate the forbidden fruit, sin entered the world. Jesus is the only person who did not sin because he was part God.
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Donaldo the supercoolio awesome nerd
in May 5th, 2007 @ 19:03Where is FS by the way? He hasn’t posted on this thread or the Evolution thread in a while! I hope we didn’t scare him away. Not that he is scared away easily.
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FrigidSymphony
in May 6th, 2007 @ 07:09No, I’ve been busy studying. And I’m in a different time zone.
Look, saying that Jesus never sinned is moronic. He was a man, had sex, probably got married, maybe even had a kid. Christianity may have different ideals at the base of what it preaches, but take a look at what they’ve been preaching and acting and you’ll see some utter hypocrisy.
As for my knowledge of Christianity, I am perfectly qualified to make such claims. I’ve read the bible, spent various years attending religious classes in school, and having people trying to indoctrinate me, telling me that I would go to hell if I masturbated, or thought for myself. I live in the country that bloody supplies the Vatican Guard! Contradiction at its finest. Why should the HQ of the religion that claims to preach peace and forgiveness need an advanced military force? I also have a knowledge of history which I’m pretty sure is superior to yours, as I’m attending a european selective liceo, the finest high school educations around. All in all, someone with historical, theological, philosofical and sociological knowledge is probably more qualified to talk about religion than an indoctrinated 12 year old.
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Dot Keet
in May 6th, 2007 @ 19:38182: Major clarification: “A Modest Proposal” is basically the definition of satire. The author was using the technique of suggesting a ridiculous solution to a current issue.
189: Um, wow. Do you live by The Da Vinci Code?? I’ve noticed a great many of your arguments are almost direct quotes.
As for your last paragraph (Age of Pisces and Aquarius and whatnot): please explain, what are you referring to? Is this a philosophy? An astrological idea? (I thought astrology was all about individual horoscopes or something.) A religious belief?
210: Erm, most people here are older than 12. And one would think someone as smart as you could spell “philosophical”.
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Duncan_Quagmire
in May 6th, 2007 @ 20:39211: Yes, I know that, but the technique Swift used to justify it was to dehumanize the children by referring to them as one would refer to them as pigs. If humans are no different than pigs, then slaughtering babies is no more or less moral than slaughtering pigs.
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E2MB
in May 6th, 2007 @ 21:22210 – Because the Vatican can’t just let people destroy them! If all the Cardinals and the Pope were killed, there would be so much… I do not even want to imagine it.
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Robert Coontz (Administrator)
in May 6th, 2007 @ 21:25At the time, poor children in Ireland were living in squalor and starving. Swift’s point was that failing to help them was just as immoral as eating them would be. People were treating them like animals; that was Swift’s way of pointing it out.
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E2MB
in May 6th, 2007 @ 23:04214 – *ponders*
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E2MB
in May 7th, 2007 @ 13:46210 – “Look, saying that Jesus never sinned is moronic. He was a man, had sex, probably got married, maybe even had a kid.” Don’t assume stuff you don’t know. How would you know if Jesus had sex or not???
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FrigidSymphony
in May 7th, 2007 @ 13:58I don’t live by the Da Vinci Code, but Dan Brown is an historian, and te facts are true.
Dammit, I misspelled philosophically?? That’s what you get for posting late at night after studying italian.
216: Because Jesus was a maaannnn and very likely had sex, like all other men!The pisces and aquarius is astrology, and has nothing to do with the current topic, but is just an amusing sidenote.
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E2MB
in May 7th, 2007 @ 16:51217 – Jesus was gooooooooooooooodddddddddddd in the form of man and thefore did not have sequal desires but you don’t belive that.
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FrigidSymphony
in May 8th, 2007 @ 10:31218: For the simple fact that God in the christian sense does not and cannot exist. Logic and reason is against it.
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E2MB
in May 8th, 2007 @ 14:30219 – “If you only had faith the size of a mustard seed, you could move mountains.” – Jesus Christ
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random dude
in May 8th, 2007 @ 17:02
AAAAAAAAANNND TODAY, LADIES AND GENTLEMAN, IN OUR OWN BLOG BOXING RING WE HAVE………..THE ASTRAURS………..
VERSUS……………..
THE CHRISTIANS!!!!!!!!!!!!!
*crowd cheers insanely*
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Potato Chip
in May 8th, 2007 @ 17:27221- I thought it was spelled “Asatruars”.
I don’t find your comment amusing, and I get the feeling it was supposed to be.
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Jadestone
in May 8th, 2007 @ 21:31What do you people feel about stem-cell research? How about genetic engineering?
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Shadowkat
in May 9th, 2007 @ 13:21197-Dude, Fridgey talks to nearly everybody in a mean, insulting, and sometimes inconsiderate way at least once…he had it coming for him.
200-It wasn’t Christopher Columbus who confirmed that the Earth was round, it was Magellan. And apocryphal means having little or no authenticity…is that how you meant to use it?
210-Hey, you just had all those people defending you, and now your going back and insulting a bunch more…keep it up, and you’ll be on your own soon enough.
221-Lol…I found it funny.
Oh, for goodness’ sakes!!! I have no side in this, I don’t care, I’m an atheist, I have no religion to support, therefore I’m pretty much staying out of it, but please! If you’re going to argue about this, do it on the (formerly) Religions thread, and leave us on the Hot Topics thread in peace!
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FrigidSymphony
in May 9th, 2007 @ 13:40220: If you had the ability and intellect to think for yourself… Ah, what the hell. Nothing I haven’t already said.
224: Who did I insult?
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E2MB
in May 9th, 2007 @ 14:04224 – The problem is the Religions thread got so out of control it got shut down. Religions is a hot topic.
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Julieb
in May 9th, 2007 @ 17:07224- I’m going with “not true, but widely believed to be true,” which I believe is a correct definition. And re Cris Columbus, many people [wrongly] think that he was the first to propose that the earth was round. He actually thought it was pear shaped. No, Magellan did not confirm the world was round, he died halfway through the trip. The honors of first to circumnavigate the earth should go to his next in command, Juan Sebastian ElCano. Even then, I think mathematicians had it figured out long before.
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E2MB
in May 9th, 2007 @ 17:47Archemedes was the first person to suggest that the earth was round and approximate it’s size. He did this by studying the angles of the sun’s rays.
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FrigidSymphony
in May 10th, 2007 @ 10:55And uh… The earth isn’t actually round, but squashed at the poles. Sort of like… um… something round that’s squashed at the poles.
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Shadowkat
in May 10th, 2007 @ 15:46227-Oh, sorry. Well, that was still on his ship. And I never said that Magellan or Columbus were the first people to suggest that the earth is round…I just said the Magellan (or someone on his ship) was first to prove it.
228-Then DaVinci wasn’t far behind, either, was he? Lol…I’m not exactly a history major.
225-I told you: nearly everyone, except the newbies, of course. For an example, check out what you started to say to E2MB before you replied to me.
229-A brilliant description, that!
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FrigidSymphony
in May 10th, 2007 @ 15:55230: I merely pointed out that the american middle school system is inferior to the average european high school system.
And yes, my descriptions are always brilliant. Just like everything else I do.
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Julieb
in May 10th, 2007 @ 19:47The earth is actually almost perfectly round, you’re right, technically it’s an oblate spheriod, but it’s easier just to say “round.” But I really don’t think this is a hot topic.
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FrigidSymphony
in May 11th, 2007 @ 11:55It isn’t a hot topic, we’re just all showing off how much we know about the earth.
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E2MB
in May 11th, 2007 @ 12:22231 – Good statement, Mr. high-self-esteem.
Seriously, what you said makes no sense. You’re saying that a high-school education in Europe is better than a middle-school education in the US. Although that’s true, high-schoolers have been in school longer and have learned more than middle-schoolers, no matter what the continent.
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FrigidSymphony
in May 12th, 2007 @ 10:05234: not only that, but the european high schools are superior to the american high schools. In any case, it gives someone attending a european high school greater authority to speak on historical, sociological and psychological issues than someone attending an american middle school.
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'Dotty-kay (formerly Dot Keet, or just Dot)
in May 12th, 2007 @ 22:07235: Right, because obviously formal education is the sole factor determining a person’s intelligence.
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FrigidSymphony .:[Blackjack Guillotine]:.
in May 14th, 2007 @ 13:50236: It’s not intelligence, dammit, it’s knowledge. If no one’s telling you what happened throughout history, or how people react to religious stimuli, then you won’t know. If no one tells you how vassallage works, then you won’t know how it’s a system devised by the clergy in order to keep the lower classes working their arses off, convinced it was divine decision, then you can’t know that.
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Jadestone
in May 14th, 2007 @ 16:13What would you call a three-d ellipse/oval? I was wondering this a while ago. And is there a proper term for “egg-shaped?”
237- I hate to say I have to agree with you, at least with some pints. They don’t do a very good job teaching history at my district. I know a lot about it that I’ve learned on my own, but they do a poor job teaching it in schools where I live. Every year we cover from the Renaissance to the Holocaust, and we have never learned about Vietnam or anything close to present day, which is what I would be more interested in learning. I had to ask other people about Vietnam when I was in 7th grade because I had no idea what it was, but all the teachers talk about it like we should know it. We don’t cover much on the ancient civilizations either, which disapoints me.
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Robert Coontz (Administrator)
in May 14th, 2007 @ 16:57(238),
A 3D ellipse/oval is called a “prolate spheroid” (if it’s symmetric, which eggs aren’t) or sometimes an “ovoid.”
The words “ovoid” and “oval” both come from ovum, the Latin word for egg.
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'Dotty-kay
in May 14th, 2007 @ 17:49237: But people can gain knowledge outside of a school. Sure, brilliant teachers and rigorous curriculums are helpful, but anyone devoted to learning can become informed regardless of where they go to school. People who go to privileged schools don’t automatically have an advantage over those who attend ordinary ones.
You’re bound to find both geniuses and slackers no matter where you end up.
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FrigidSymphony .:[Blackjack Guillotine]:.
in May 15th, 2007 @ 14:45But you can also live in a society where not much info is available. Like the US.
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FrigidSymphony .:[Blackjack Guillotine]:.
in May 15th, 2007 @ 14:47Oh, and btw: Satan strikes!
Extremely right-wing, baptist televangelist Jery Falwell bit it. found dead in his office, it isn’t clear how he died. Several quotes that have spewed from his bloated, homophobic, racist mouth include:
“AIDS is the wrath of a just God against homosexuals.”
“I hope to see the day when, as in the early days of our country, we don’t have public schools. The churches will have taken them over again and Christians will be running them.”
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Margaret
in May 15th, 2007 @ 15:33Jerry Falwell died. Okay, sad for his family and all…but seriously, goodness knows there’s enough hate in the world without Jerry.
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Jadestone
in May 15th, 2007 @ 17:21241- There’s always the internet. Lots of good science websites that post articles on recent stuff, and there’s always a ton of information on anything elselike history, ect.
Don’t know (or care, really) who Jerry Farwell is. Doesn’t really sound like someone I’d get along with though.
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Shadowkat
in May 15th, 2007 @ 17:34244-Ditto on Jerry.
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Margaret
in May 15th, 2007 @ 21:30“I really believe that the pagans, and the abortionists, and the feminists, and the gays and the lesbians who are actively trying to make that an alternative lifestyle, the ACLU, People For the American Way, all of them who have tried to secularize America,” he said. “I point the finger in their face and say ‘You helped this happen.’ ”
– Jerry Falwell on 9/11.He also said that when The Antichrist comes, he “must be, of necessity, a Jewish male”.
Plus, he’s the guy who said that the Teletubbies are dangerous because Tinky Winky is gay and promotes a gay agenda to innocent toddlers.
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FrigidSymphony .:[Blackjack Guillotine]:.
in May 17th, 2007 @ 06:22246: But Tinky Winky is gay. Or at least, extremely metrosexual.
Honestly, good riddance to that arse.
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Donaldo the supercoolio nerd
in May 19th, 2007 @ 20:09I don’t really care who Jerry Falwell is. I don’t think I would like him. FS, I am wondering how well you would get along with Martin Luther(no, not Martin Luther King). He was also extremely single-minded, and was unopen to negotiation. His way or the highway, kinda like you. That was not an insult, that was a comment. He was also against the MEDIEVAL Catholic Church, like you and me. I am doing a report on him, and think he was a great guy, you know. He was the guy who started Protestantism and stopped the practice of selling indulgences. He also argued against pretty much all of the Church’s teachings, like it’s stuff about Purgatory and how you would have to stay there for a certain amount of time, until your sins were paid off. BTW, Purgatory is different from Hell.
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FrigidSymphony .:[Blackjack Guillotine]:.
in May 20th, 2007 @ 05:53248: I am against Christianity in general. If Luther were living today, trust me, he’d be just like me. And I know what purgatory is, and it’s not that nice a place either. There’s also Limbo, where unbaptized kids go. Now tell me, is Hell any different now than it was 500 years ago? If what the clergy preaches on the earth changes, does what is above and below change as well?
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Shadowkat
in May 20th, 2007 @ 12:08246-What a jerk.
247-True, true…it was really disturbing…my brother used to watch that show, and then we heard about this one kid who was talking fine, and then he started watching Teletubbies, and after a while, slipped back into baby talk…freaky.
248-Yeah, Martin Luther was pretty cool…I don’t know much about him, but what I’ve heard, I’ve liked.
249-Oh, geez…have you read the X-Men comics, like, the original ones? Some of them got trapped in Limbo, and they almost went insane…it was kinda scary…
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Beavo the Great
in May 20th, 2007 @ 12:22246-Who cares if a stupid telletubie is gay? The whole show is gay, and plus it promotes cannibalism because the vacum cleaner ate Po once. Belive me, if you really want to get freaked out about a whole bunch of stupid TV shows for toddlers, watch BooBah. *gag*
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FrigidSymphony .:[Blackjack Guillotine]:.
in May 20th, 2007 @ 13:14Umpf today I saw a documentary from the BBC about paedophile priests. The priests were covered up by the Church, by a group led by… Cardinal Josef Ratzinger, now Pope Benedict the whatsoever.
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widdershins (e~a)
in May 20th, 2007 @ 17:00251- wait, is the vacuum cleaner the same species as Po? because otherwise it’s not cannibalism. *nods* my, that’s a weird comment. Cannibalism in tv. Who cares? it’s a kids show.
I must make sure that you are using gay to mean homosexual or joyful, not stupid, right? because the word gay is not a synonym for stupid. but you probably aren’t. Hopefully you are either indicating the telletubies show is homosexual or joyfull. If you weren’t, could you please not use “gay” as a synonym for stupid?
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Jadestone
in May 20th, 2007 @ 18:07248- I agreed with many of his views, actually, when we learned about him. He’s an interesting guy.
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E2MB
in May 20th, 2007 @ 19:08Oh what the heck the telletubbies are stupid! End of discussion!
FS: My school, to my dissapointment, has been teaching me a lot of stuff this year that I already knew. I knew that stuff because I read encyclopedias and non-fiction books in a lot of my spare time. I go to the library every week, looking for books not only for school but ones that look interesting. My brain is so crammed full of factoids I have one for almost any occasion. Say, did you know Luxembourg has, on average, the richest people on the planet? Or that people made up 13% of all labor done in the Czech Republic in 1973? (Most everything else was done by machines.)
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E2MB
in May 22nd, 2007 @ 23:15DEAD THREAD!!! just kidding
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Donaldo the supercoolio nerd
in May 24th, 2007 @ 16:25249-BIGGEST LOL EVER!!!!!! HAHAHAHAHAHA! IF MARTIN LUTHER LIVED TODAY, YOU WOULD DEFINITELY NOT BE LIKE HIM! HAR HAR HAR! GOOD ONE FS! FOR ONE THING, Luther was a Christian and started Protestanism, which includes just about every version of Christianity besides Roman Catholicism. I am Presbyterian, a form of Protestantism, and yet you agree with me! IF MARTIN LUTHER WERE JUST LIKE YOU, THEN YOU WOULD HAVE TO BE A CHRISTIAN SAINT!! HAHAHAHA! YOU WOULD BE ALL FOR GOD AND JESUS, AND AGAINST THE POPE!!!! COME ON! HOW STUPID DO YOU THINK I AM? YOU WOULD BE THE EXACT OPPOSITE OF HIM!! YOU WOULD BE HIS ARCHRIVAL, EVEN MORE SO THAN POPE LEO X WAS!!!!! HAHAHAHAHAHA *wipes tears from his eyes* OMG! THAT WAS AN UNEXPECTED COMMENT FS!! HAHA! TRUST ME, I KNOW A LOT ABOUT LUTHER!!!! I DID A REPORT ON HIM THIS YEAR!!! YOU ARE DEFINITELYNOT ANYTHING LIKE MARTIN LUTHER!
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FrigidSymphony .:[Blackjack Guillotine]:.
in May 25th, 2007 @ 15:01You have absolutely no idea at all.
Around Luther’s time, Christianity simply was. It was a fact of life. There was no escaping it. What Luther did was far more radical than what I’m doing now. He openly criticized the Church, and I mean the Roman Catholic Church, down in Vatican City. Church with a huge capital C. This was unheard of. He had to go into hiding to avoid being burned to death, by Satan! Sure, he was Christian, but for his time and place being Christian was like being omnivorous. You were, and being anything else was unheard of.
Luther was highly critical of the orthodox dogma, the rules that were established. As am I. He was radical and innovative, as am I, although I am not the first of my kind. He was outspoken and honest, as am I. He was intelligent and philosphical, as am I. He knew about Christian mythology and theology, as do I, to an extent.
The fact that you did a report on Luther gives you just about… a bit more authority to speak about him. Assuming you did in fact research your report, and didn’t just ask your local priest.
I expect if Luther were here today we’d get along great.
The problem in your thinking is that since Luther was Christian, and I am a pagan who hates Christianity with a passion, that we could in no way get along, or be in any way similar. Wrong. Our thinking corresponds in many ways. Challenging the dogma accepted by everyone as absolute truth, challenging the authority that has extreme power over people… Me and ole Luther would have been great pals, if not for the 5 century time gap.
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Shadowkat
in May 25th, 2007 @ 19:19257, 258-Oh, stop it, you two…you’re never going to agree, and you’re just going to keep insulting each other, so give it up.
I think we should talk about Ron Paul, and how the media isn’t covering his campaign.
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Rebecca Lasley (Administrator)
in May 25th, 2007 @ 19:34(259) I read an article about Ron Paul just this morning. Apparently he’s been getting a lot of attention since his comments about Iraq at the debate last week.
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Donaldo the supercoolio awesome nerd
in May 26th, 2007 @ 00:42258-Wow, YEAH RIGHT! Isn’t that weird? I think, if Luther were alive today, him and me would be best buds. Guess we have more in common than we thought. LOL.
And FYI, not all Christians today are Roman Catholic. Martin Luther basically crushed religious unity in western medieval Europe. I am not. I think that it is great that Martin Luther crushed the Roman Catholic Church. And I know this was unheard of, speaking out against the church. I did a report on him, for Pete’s sake! AND NEXT TIME, DON’T YOU EVER INSULT ME LIKE THAT AGAIN! OF COURSE I RESEARCHED AND DIDN’T JUST GO TO MY PRIEST. LIKE MY PASTOR WOULD OFF THE TOP OF HIS HEAD KNOW THE LIFE STORY OF MARTIN LUTHER!!!! NO HE WOULDN’T!!!! I AM A STRAIGHT A STUDENT AND RESEARCH ALL MY REPORTS!!!!YOU DO NOT REALIZE THAT MARTIN WAS NOT ATHEISTIC LIKE YOU!!! HE WAS A DEVOUT CHRISTIAN, UNLIKE YOU!!!! IT IS IMPOSSIBLE FOR YOU TO BE FRIENDS!!! TRUST ME, HE WAS SO SINGLE-MINDED THAT HE WOULD NOT BE PERSUADED INTO SOMEONE ELSE’S BELIEFS!!! SO YOU COULDN’T BE BEST FRIENDS!!!! MARTIN WAS CHRISTIAN, YOU ARE NOT!!!! HE WOULD HATE YOU BECAUSE YOU WERE NOT CHRISTIAN!!!!! HE DID NOT AGREE WITH ANYONE THAT DID NOT AGREE WITH HIS TEACHINGS TRUST ME!
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FrigidSymphony .:[Blackjack Guillotine]:.
in May 26th, 2007 @ 06:28He was christian because everyone in that chronological and geogaphical period was. And everyone was Catholic. Of course Luther wasn’t an atheist, that was inconceivable to anyone at the time. What I’m pointing out, in non-capitalized words with no exclamation marks, is that what Luther and I have in common is the challenging of the established religious authority. Protestantism at the time was new and radical, now it too is something old. And btw, Luther didn’t ‘crush’ the Roman Catholic Church, he created a seperate church for his own vision of Christianity. The schism of course caused no end of bloodshed on the topic of whether or not the Pope is actually God’s voice on Earth. But Luther was outspoken and radical, new and intelligent, single-minded and convinced, critical of established religious authority. All things that I am too. Go listen to your Jerry Falwell recordings, why don’t you.
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Duncan_Quagmire
in May 26th, 2007 @ 09:22261: I’m a Christian, and I have friends who are atheists…
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Shadowkat
in May 26th, 2007 @ 13:05Donaldo, stop getting so excited…caps and exclamation points won’t make someone agree with you any more than will normal typing.
Fridgey, stop insulting Donaldo…you’re just getting him more and more riled up. If you want to state a fact or opinion, do so, but not when you’re directly insulting the person opposed to it. Insult the view, not the viewer.
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FrigidSymphony .:[Blackjack Guillotine]:.
in May 26th, 2007 @ 13:39Oh, because he isn’t insulting me at all, right? No, he’s just attempting to make my statements seem ridicolous and not to be taken seriously, while stating no facts other than the empyrical claim that since Luther was Christian, he and I could never be friends. Bollocks.
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Jadestone
in May 26th, 2007 @ 14:21Yes, he is insulting you FS, but no one really takes cap-lock seriously anyway. No, that does not mean you should insult him back. I have both Christian and atheist friends, and I know people of other religions too. Religon should not place a barrier between to people’s friendship. If Luther was alive now, he probably might have a problem with today’s churches as well without having to be atheist.
Fridgy and Luther would probably agree on many points regarding the corruption of the curch, and dissagre on other things in religion.
However, we have no way of really knowing for sure so this is spiriling towards pointlessness.Who is Ron Paul?
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E2MB
in May 26th, 2007 @ 14:47Donaldo the supercoolio awesome nerd, stop it with the caps lock and general weirdness. You’re starting to insult FS, and you don’t want to do that. Then he’ll have another argument to make against you.
FS, just ignore Donaldo. He’s a little hyper right now, but he’ll calm down later. I hope.
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'Dotty-kay
in May 26th, 2007 @ 21:52257: I don’t get it. You said, “FS, I am wondering how well you would get along with Martin Luther.” And then you went on to point out all the similar qualities. Were you being sarcastic? Why are you acting like it was a joke?
258: Surely you mean “Around Luther’s time and place?” I can believe it was like that in Europe, but the whole world? Pssht. Talk about Eurocentricism.
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'Dotty-kay
in May 26th, 2007 @ 21:53262: “…everyone in that chronological and geogaphical period was…” That’s all right then. I was a little harsh before, but you were really exaggerating.
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FrigidSymphony .:[Blackjack Guillotine]:.
in May 27th, 2007 @ 08:39269: Actually I was not exaggerating. Apart from Europe, nothing else was really important.
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E2MB
in May 27th, 2007 @ 09:30270 – I think East Asia mattered quite a bit. It just didn’t have much contact with Europe.
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Lizzie
in May 27th, 2007 @ 10:16270- let’s see; during the 1400s and 1500s, the following happened (not necessarily in chronological order) :
-Civil war in Japan, which resulted in the rise in power of daimyo, gave certain religious groups political power, and led to and the weakening of the central government;
-The Aztec Empire becomes the dominant power in mesoamerica under the leadership of Moctezuma
– The Inca Empire is founded
– The capital of China is moved from Nanjing to Beijing
– Zheng He sails to India, Arabia, East Africa
– A Malay sultanate was founded
– Construction of the Forbidden City is completed in Beijing
– The Ottoman Empire descends into and recovers from civil war
– The Golden Horde broke up into several groups
– Hangul, the native Korean alphabet, is developed
– Ottoman Empire expands further
– Mississippian culture disappears
– The Safavid dynasty rules Iran
– Ottoman Empire gains Eastern Anatolia, Egypt, Arabia, the Levant
– Mir Chakar Kand Rind settles in Punjab
– Spaniards conquer Mexico (technically not in Europe)
– Height of the Ottoman Empire is reached with the reign of Sulieman the Magnificent
– Chinese forces prevent the Portuguese from invading
– Ottoman empire conquers yet more places
– Mughal Empire rules India
– Nanban trade period begins
– Shaanxi Earthquake in China – history’s deadliest known earthquake
– Akbar expands the Mughal Empire
– Mir Chakar Khan Rind captures Delhi
– Akbar reconciles Hindu and Muslim factions
– Mir Chakar Khan Rind dies
– Azuchi-Momoyama period begins (Japan)
– Spanish conquistadores kill the last Inca leader
– Yermak Timofeyevich conquers the Siberia Khanate
– Korea, with the help of China, repells two Japanese invasions
other significant people in this period include:
Abu Sa’id al-Afif
Zheng He
Sejong the Great of Joseon
Mehmed II
Mir Chakar Khan Rind
Suleiman the Magnificent
Cuauhtémoc
Qiu Ying, a Chinese painter
Ahmad ibn Ibrihim al-Ghazi, a Somali imam and general
Oda Nobunaga, of Japan
Zhu Yijun, emperor of China
Toyotomi Hideyoshi, of Japan
Admiral Yi Sun-sin, Korea, one of the greatest admirals of the world
Miyamoto Musashi, famous warrior and author of a book on strategyetc
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Lizzie
in May 27th, 2007 @ 10:19keep in mind that that list is incomplete and does not for the most part include Africa, Oceania, or the Americas
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FrigidSymphony .:[Blackjack Guillotine]:.
in May 27th, 2007 @ 11:54And how much of that impacted on the world today? Sure, some of it, but not much.
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Lizzie
in May 27th, 2007 @ 14:01I’d say a fair amount; sure, maybe not a whole lot directly, but in the relationships of different groups of people, in prejudices, in where things/people are located, in the current political/social/cultural/economic conditions of various places.
also, little pet peeve of mine: the only thing that can be grammatically impacted is, I believe, a tooth. Everything else has an impact.
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Shadowkat
in May 27th, 2007 @ 19:19Ay, me…I give up!
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FrigidSymphony .:[Blackjack Guillotine]:.
in May 28th, 2007 @ 08:26What’s a recent hot topic… Dammit, I know it’s there somewhere, but I can’t remember what it is!
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Shadowkat
in May 28th, 2007 @ 13:00How about……..the War in Iraq? I don’t think we’ve talked about that, yet, have we? I’m kind of surprised…
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Donaldo the supercoolio awesome nerd
in May 30th, 2007 @ 22:01FS-No, I think the church was corrupt, too, just like you. But I also know Martin didn’t just fight the Catholic Church. He fought against Jews, peasants, and witchcraft(which the Norse practiced, mind you), plus many other world religions. If you were not a Protestant(and you aren’t), he would not like you at all. He had a horrible temper, and would argue against anyone who wouldn’t agree with him, no matter who they were or what religion they were. Another point: You do not practice Satanism, yet you agree with some of its views and have no problem with people who do practice it. Martin Luther wrote many books declaring the papacy to be a thing created by the Devil, and the pope to be a voice of Satan.
Tell me now how he could agree with someone who basically has no problem with Satan followers, when he said that anyone who did not agree with his Protestant views and become a Protestant was a Satan-follower. Therefore, you are a Satan follower and he could not agree with you at all because of that fact that you are not a Protestant and you are OK with Satan followers and have no problem with them.
And FS, in response to post 219-NOT EVERYTHING IN THIS WORLD IS EXPLAINED WITH LOGIC AND REASON!!!!
BTW FS-read “Reclaiming Science From Darwinism” by Dr. Kenneth Poppe. It is a fantastic book that completely disproves Darwinism and evolution, but that is another topic for another thread, so that is all! Buh bye now!
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Donaldo the supercoolio awesome nerd
in May 30th, 2007 @ 22:02277-I have an idea, FS. If you are going to come up with another hot topic, how about something we can agree on? That would be interesting. LOL
278-NO!!! PLEASE NOT!!!!
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Shadowkat
in May 31st, 2007 @ 20:01280-Why not?
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FrigidSymphony .:[Blackjack Guillotine]:.
in June 1st, 2007 @ 15:11279: Because on those things Luther was ignorant. For him, satan meant evil. Brilliant. So did pagans and witches. Good job, nice education. But his mentality towards authoritarian organization was a lot like mine.
281: God forbid anyone criticize the holy war conducted by the glorious commander in chief to free the poor iraqi people from their evil dictator, gaining absolutely no oil in the process. Yup, the iraq war was a completely altruistic act on behalf of Bush, that wonderful Christian.
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Jadestone
in June 1st, 2007 @ 15:29Why do people think Paganism is evil, anyway? It seems a lot more peaceful than other unmentioned religions to me.
I am against the war in Iraq. it’s been going on for far to long now and is hearby declared a WOMBAT.
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E2MB
in June 1st, 2007 @ 21:48The war in Iraq had a good intention, but Dubya messed it all up.
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E2MB
in June 1st, 2007 @ 21:50282 – Before you start labeling Christians as morons and stupidos because George Bush was one, please tell me what you would have done if you were in his shoes.
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FrigidSymphony .:[Blackjack Guillotine]:.
in June 2nd, 2007 @ 04:08In Bush’s shoes? I would never have won the election, because my moral ethics forbid me to cheat in something as essential as democracy. [Long rant omitted. –Robert]
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FrigidSymphony .:[Blackjack Guillotine]:.
in June 2nd, 2007 @ 04:46283: And pagans are not evil, but the church has been saying so for two thousand years, just because they’re not Christian.
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Shadowkat
in June 2nd, 2007 @ 09:08We should never have even gone to Iraq. If the Iraqis wanted freedom, they should’ve risen up against Saddam themselves. The U.S. needs to keep its @$$ out of countries where it doesn’t belong…out foreign policy sucks. We brought 9/11 upon ourselves. Not the general population, technically, but yet, still us, because we put up with such disgusting and atrocious policies.
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BiblioRose
in June 2nd, 2007 @ 10:04hey, I’m not saying President Bush has been the best in the world but let’s just consider what he has had to deal with.
A major terrorist attack
the worst natural disaster in U.S history
Several major Tsunamis elsewhere in the world, but that he still had to help with
The possibilty of several countries with nuclear weaponsAnd now everyone hates him for a decision they originally agreed on. I’m not trying to defend him just food for thought.
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FrigidSymphony .:[Blackjack Guillotine]:.
in June 2nd, 2007 @ 10:32289: And he dealed atrociously with every problem, and wose. He used 9/11 as an excuse to attack Iraq, which did NOT have nuclear weapons, btw, whereas North Korea does, and we all know how decisive Bush is with them.
Who agreed on what decision? Bush ignored the UN and invaded Iraq using the fear of terrorism to get people to agree, even when Saddam was in no way linked with 9/11
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Jadestone
in June 2nd, 2007 @ 10:58287- No duh.
Besides the fact that the US has more nuclear weapons than we’ll ever (hopefully) need. I hate how hypocritical it made the US look when he invaded Iraq because ‘they had nuclear weapons.’
290- When he declared war on Iraq origanally, there was a lot more suppoert for it, acording to polls. I don’t trust the polls, and I certainly didn’t want war (I was also in 5th grade, however), and neither did many people I talked too.
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Shadowkat
in June 2nd, 2007 @ 19:20289-Don’t call me a conspiracy theorist, but do watch a video called Loose Change…it’s an hour and nineteen minutes, but well worth the time…get your family to watch it, too, if possible…it’s very interesting and informative.
291-Unfortunately, the U.S. government has come to view itself as the most powerful nation in the world, and, therefore, ruler of said world. Now, though it may be true about the U.S. being the most powerful nation in the world, that’s no excuse for us to go flaunting and abusing our position…and at the rate we’re going, we won’t hold that position for very long.
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BiblioRose
in June 3rd, 2007 @ 14:11290-Every person who voted for him knew what he stood for and what he was going to do about certian problems. The majority of the country approved of those decisions. Now his approval rate is in the 30’s which is definitly not the majority of the country. People forget how difficult it is to be the president. I definitly do not agree with every single thing President Bush stands for. But do people think that by making bush stress dolls, and Bush caricitures, and bashing him openly is going to solve the problem? Whats done is done and we need to solve the problem not dwell on how stupid it was to begin with. And they may not have nuclear weapons, but it clear that they want us to die because we are Americans, not because of Bush but because we are Americans. And please don’t give me any of that stuff about not being your intellectual equal.
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FrigidSymphony .:[Blackjack Guillotine]:.
in June 3rd, 2007 @ 14:30293: No, they did not. He stole the election, you knew about that? It was a whole scam, the people who gave him the votes were friends of his father. He was ushered in by rich oil tycoons (again, daddy’s friends) and he invaded Iraq to pay back his campaign financers.
And you know what? Saddam did NOT want americans to die, he was merely a dictator who controlled lots of oil. The Al Qaida terrorists who attacked New York on September eleventh had NOTHING to do with Iraq or Saddam. Bush lied to the americans to be able to attack Iraq for his own reasons, and now there’s a huge mess which he is doing nothing to solve because he’s leaving it to the democrats to solve in 2008. Brilliant.
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Potato Chip
in June 3rd, 2007 @ 20:21More than half of the people in my school think that the twin towers were bombed by Iraq.
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E2MB
in June 3rd, 2007 @ 22:55289 – Plus Hurricane Katrina, and etc.
I’m suprised Bush hasn’t resigned as president by now. He’s had the awful and difficult luck of the draw events of just about any president in the past 200 years, and now people are calling him stupid right and left for not handling the situation right. Bush is under stress, people! Help him, don’t hurt him!
294 – Ahm…..since you don’t seem to like Bush, how’s the prez in Switzerland doing? Do you have presidents over there?
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E2MB
in June 3rd, 2007 @ 22:56295 – That’s sad.
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biblioRose
in June 4th, 2007 @ 12:43296- Thank You! Amen to that! Also, hurricane Katrina was the worst natural disaster in U.S history! However I think resighning now would make him look like a coward. Thats the thing. If he doesn’t resighn everybody ridicules him and says he should. If he does they will ridicule him for the aforementionded reasons. I think I lied. I am a teensy bit interested in politics. Just a teensy bit.
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Julieb
in June 4th, 2007 @ 14:20That doesn’t escuse FEMA for being so late! It’s their job to be on the scene of a disaster right away, and they weren’t. It’s Bush’s job to make sure competent people are running these departments. And not everything was out of his control. Guantanamo definitely wasn’t. Nuclear weapons are not our problem, that’s the UN’s job. The reason why Bush is hated because he doesn’t do what he’s supposed to, and does what he’s not. Yes, the congress aproved going to war, but under false pretenses because of faulty intelligence. They’ve admitted it was a mistake, commander in chief won’t. So while not everything may be his fault, he’s not blameless.
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BiblioRose
in June 5th, 2007 @ 19:18I’m not neccesarily agreeing with his decisons, but for the spoiled american people no president will ever be good enough. People here complain and whine about small things when other countries are living in poverty, living in filth, and beaten if they speak out agianst the goverment. I’m sick of the complaining, because we have no way of knowing whether or not outcomes would have been different. I think we should all be grateful we live in a wonderful, amazing country like this!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Sobriquet (Julieb)
in June 5th, 2007 @ 19:42300- We’re just saying, it would be nice to live in a wonderful, amazing country that wasn’t at war, and that wasn’t hated throughout the world. I don’t think those are small things. The Monica Lewinsky scandal was small (or should have been.) The war is big.
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Shadowkat
in June 6th, 2007 @ 08:52Will someone here at least check out Ron Paul, and tell me what you think?
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BiblioRose
in June 6th, 2007 @ 13:04301- Being hated is a little thing. Reputation will not effect our state of well- being. I understand what you mean and I can respect that and even agree with it. It’s just I think people do need to be grateful.
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FrigidSymphony .:[Blackjack Guillotine]:.
in June 6th, 2007 @ 13:30We have 7 presidents, 3 for one party, 3 for another, and 1 for the least powerful party at the moment. Then it all changes.
Look, there’s absolutely no defending Bush. His whole cabinet is corrupt, inefficient and brainless. Bush himself only got to Yale because of his dad’s connections. Don’t say the poor guy is under stress, 9/11 could easily have been avoided had he only listened to the FBI terror warnings and not taken a 3 month holiday. Hurricane Katrina could also have been avoided, all he had to do was reform his energy and environment policies. Bush is a terrible president, even worse than Warren G Harding.
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BiblioRose
in June 6th, 2007 @ 15:38Hurricane Katrina could not have been avoided! If it was anything more than a fluke of nature than what was building up to it had started way before president Bush was even president! And he is under stress, he’s running a country for pete’s sake! In any sistuation a leader is always under some stress. And how do we know the FBI terror warnings couldn’t have been wrong? You bash him for making the decision to believe warnings of nuclear weapons, but also bash him for not believing them?
Anyway, on a happier note does anyone here want know of Angela Merkel, the german chancellor? She is very cool.
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Shadowkat
in June 6th, 2007 @ 16:13305-Well, look, even if a warning isn’t true, you should always take precautions, no matter how inconvenient…just in case. And we’ll not get into the whole 9/11 thing, again.
Btw, can we have a new thread, please?
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biblioRose
in June 6th, 2007 @ 17:55306- Than what about the warnngs of nuclear weapons? So he should have avoided those but recognized the others?
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Shadowkat
in June 6th, 2007 @ 18:16307-What do you mean? I said that one should take precautions, and not just say, “Well, I don’t think that’ll happen, so I won’t worry about it.”
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BiblioRose
in June 6th, 2007 @ 20:03I know, but that was the situation President Bush was in with nuclear weapons, yet according to many he shouldn’t have believed that threat. That’s what I meant.
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FrigidSymphony .:[Blackjack Guillotine]:.
in June 7th, 2007 @ 05:29There were no warnings of nuclear weapons! He made them up, lying to the country, as an excuse to invade Iraq for his own reasons. YOu should find out more about what he did before you start defending him.
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Shadowkat
in June 7th, 2007 @ 08:45310-Finally, something we agree on!
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Robert Coontz (Administrator)
in June 7th, 2007 @ 08:48Agreement? Wow. I’d better start a new thread before something happens to spoil the harmony.
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