Mathematics
Not “Math and Math Geeks” this time around. This thread is math with di gnity.
Date: December 27, 2009
Categories: The Universe, Things We like
Saturday, 21 September 2019
Life, the universe, pies, hot-pink bunnies, world domination, and everything
Not “Math and Math Geeks” this time around. This thread is math with di gnity.
Date: December 27, 2009
Categories: The Universe, Things We like
“X” equals the opposite of “b” plus or minus the square root of “b” sqared minus four times “a” times “c” all over 2 times “a.”
Yeah… quadratic formula…. I totally messed up on that test.
First post?
I don’t think I’ll ever forget the quadratic formula. Possibly because she taught it to us using the tune of ‘Pop Goes the Weasel”. Very earworm-y
Negative ‘b’
plus or minus
square root ‘b’ squared
minus four ‘a”c’
All over two ‘a’
Well, it helps me remember it at least.
Oh, yes. I remember that we would walk around singing that at the top of our lungs at math camp. The summer school students at the college we were staying at must have thought we were crazy.
I used to draw comics about Mathematicians. And unicorns. I wanted to be a mathematician until I found out what they actually do. Now I’m going to be an animator. If my drawing skills ever get good enough.
I like sine, cosine and tangent. Also: asymtotes. I relate my rules of physical contact to asymtotes (ex. I am an asymtote, you are not allowed to touch me, ever). I hate fractions and decimals. There is nothing so horrible as an answer that is not a whole number. I also hate the square root when it is not perfect answer.
*cheers* Math thread!!!
My friend and I were recently talking about our favorite algebraic expressions. She likes a-squared – b-squared = c-squared and I like y=mx + b. My math teacher wanted us to write that before all our linear equations: quote, “I want y=mx+b to be in your dreams tonight.”
Hey, what happened to my other post? Anyway…mathematics is fun and my favorite equation is y=mx+b. *is annoyed about missing post that took me longer than usual to type* Anyway, I think I accidentally used Pseudonym’s name.
Favorite equation: Pythagorean.
Are we allowed to ask math problems on here?
I like math a lot. After all, it’s my sport. (I do math team.) There’s something very soothing about turning coffee into theorems.
I have a favorite theorem, although it’s not really a favorite equation. It’s called the Chicken McNugget Theorem (seriously), and it’s a number theory theorem.
Speaking of number theory, what are everyone’s favorite branches of math? I like discrete math more than continuous math, and my favorite is probably mathematical logic. I particularly dislike geometry.
I like geometry, but I despise protractors
Well, constructions only require compass and straightedge. Of course, you can’t construct everything…
I like lines and stuff! Because it looks so pretty when you draw all those shapes and lines on one graph, and they all intersect…*happy sigh* My math teacher always tells me to do them on separate graphs. And, by the way, post 3 was me accidentally on Pseudo’s name. Annoying Thing Number Sixteen about having a sister.
Have I mentioned how much I love the AP Calculus BC class I’m taking this school year? The integration and differentiation gets kind of boring (although it’s my favorite of the things I’ve done in class over the past few years), but I am expected to be able to memorize techniques without infinite repetition in class, and things continually awe me with the way they suddenly make sense and interrelate. Whenever I see things with curves I want to integrate them. :/
I’m on math team still. (right now, I’m having a mediocre year, but tied with 10 other people for 18th in the four counties which make up the local zone within the state.)
I like insanely complicated stuff. And geometry proofs. And I love algebra. And trigonometry sounds good.
The quadratic formula? Once upon a time, we did formulas in math, Mr D wrote the quadratic formula on the board and freaked us all out by saying that at the end of Year 10 (2 years away) we’d know it and how to derive it. I found out what it was when I was talking with my dad about math class and he mentioned it. I hope I’ll get Mr D again, but I probably won’t.
I must say, I ♥ the field of mathematics that is blurred with music, such as the overtone series, harmonics, circle of fifths….
Yeah.
Pi tunes, etc.
Ditto for the field of mathematics that relates to art: the golden section, nautilus shell, blah blah blah…
I recently finished a course in Linear Algebra. And I have only one thing to say about it: Make sure you get a good teacher for it, because it’s really hard to learn that stuff on your own, a lot of it is confusing/counterintuitive.
Not necessarily just art- nature.
-A
Oh, I’m taking linear algebra right now. It’s fun. But it also sucks because I work alone because I have the same math period as the other 7th graders, even though I’m doing 9th grade math.
That’s odd that you say you need a good teacher, because I think my school offers linear algebra as an independent study.
Mind you, this is college level linear algebra. I’m not actually sure if there’s any difference, but…
I think that what my school offers is college-level linear algebra, since the people taking it are seniors (and an occasional junior) who have finished MVC.
I like fractals and the Fibonacci sequence. Patterns are awesome.
Has anyone read The Number Devil? It was my favorite book in second grade. What annoys me now about it is the fact that the actual terms for the math functions aren’t used (“rutabega” instead of “root”, etc.). I ended up calling “factorial” “vroom” until Algebra II in 8th grade when my teacher kindly informed me of its real name.
I adore The Number Devil. And I also called factorial vroom until I took combinatorics.
Yes! The Number Devil has been one of my favorite books for years! I even took a class based off of it in the summer one year. I also used to invent handshake problems as brain teasers for my class as I’d been told how to solve them and everyone else had a difficult time. We were supposed to come up with brainteasers sometimes in sixth grade and they were assigned at the beginning of the day.
13 – Hahaha! I can just imagine Ms. H going, “Er, a factorial isn’t actually a “vroom”. It’s a factorial.”
DARN IT- I used Pseudonym’s account thingie again, sorry!
I miss my algebra teacher from last year, Ms. L. I had her for pre-algebra, too. To help us temember that lines that went from bottom left to upper right were positive, she had us all get up and do the “disco, disco” pointing fingers. (You know what I mean. That thing where you have to go “disco, disco” when you do it.) Then she had us sing “y equals mx plus b!” to the tune of “Follow the yellow brick road!” for nearly ten minutes early in the year. And her birthday was on Pi Day, and she’d have a contest where whoever in the class memorized the most of pi would be bought a really good pie. Oh, and she was really, really, really organized, and gave people who aced tests boxes of Nerds (geddit?) and hole-punched everything with a hole punch shaped like a heart. And she had a different stamp for homework-stamping for every day of the year.
Then this year she suddenly was very pregnant and I didn’t see her do anything but run the chocolate fountain at Homecoming. Which was amazing.
3.14159265358979!
3.142592653589793238462643383279502884197169
3.1415926535897932384626433832795028841971693993751058209749445923078164062862089986280348253421170679821480865132823066470938446095505820812843111
You both sound like my old math teacher.
I changed my avatar again! It’s a different part of the Mandelbrot set. Actually, the last one wasn’t, exactly, but it was still created using the Mandelbrot set.
For those who don’t know what that is, here’s the Wikipedia link:
e n.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mandelbrot_set
It’s probably really long and confusing, so basically it’s a graph depicting all the numbers that fulfill a certain qualification.
I don’t thoroughly understand it, but I can still use it as my avatar.
Today I took MAP testing for math. I realized that I didn’t know how to find the slope using the x-intercept and y-intercept. We did it in math class last month. I felt really stupid.
I love math. I’m on a campaign to try to be president of both of the math clubs at my school. I’m in geometry this year (never took it), but I took calculus last year.
.
.
Have any of you read Martin Gardner’s books on math? They’re all about puzzles and little games and brainteasers. Not the normal, kind of boring ones that you see in math classes, but genuinely difficult and fun ones. I’d recommend checking those out. “Casual Mathematics,” I believe that it’s called.
Both math clubs? You have two? Nice. (I mean, we have several here, but that’s because it’s a math-focused school.)
Also, may I ask how you get to calculus without ever taking a simple geometry course? I mean, even if calc doesn’t directly build on geometry, trig builds on geometry and calc builds on trig. Seriously, I think our education system puts too high a value on calculus. I mean, there’s all this cool math out there that most people don’t even encounter because they’re just trying to get through calculus. There are lots of math-y people who get to calculus long before they do any sort of discrete math. I won’t rant all day here, but I recommend you read the article “The Calculus Trap”. (Just google it.) It explains it really well.
Logarithms! I hated them for a few days, but now I love them. Anyone else like logarithms?
I like logarithms! But I would, wouldn’t I?
Well, they were incredible frustrating at first, but then I figured out that all they’re asking is which exponent that you raise the base to will equal x or whatever it is. That’s it! Lovely.
(Was that even grammatically correct?)
Yes, you would.
Not so much. I didn’t quite get the hang of them when I was introduced to them in sixth grade, and I haven’t liked them much since. They’re pretty simple and elegant, and I’m not sure why I don’t like them, but I don’t. And I should make sure I’m comfortable with them before the big test that includes them tomorrow.
6th grade? Major school system difference. *just did them a few months ago and is a sophomore* I kinda like them, but I still prefer Algebra by miles. Now I just need to figure out the weird ways of the American math school system. *goes off to google math terms*
STFDP:
I meant google translate. If google is up for the job
Logs are algebra. What about algebra do you like better?
Oh no. Not everyone does logs in sixth grade. It was a 9th grade honors class that was generally taught to the top few 8th graders at my school.
Typically, American math education goes like this:
9th grade: Algebra 1
10th grade: Geometry
11th grade: Algebra 2
12th grade: Precalculus
College: Calculus
I think most Americans stop after calculus, but after that there’s multi-variable calculus and differential equations and linear algebra and lots of other fun stuff. (I think I’m getting a little overexcited.)
Often (such as in my old school district), geometry and algebra 2 are switched. Almost all honors students are a year ahead of the average (finishing calculus senior year). Some students are quite a few years ahead. I know of 8th graders (not very many, though) taking calculus, and I was actually scheduled to take calculus freshman year, before I decided to avoid the “calculus trap”. (See above post for rant about how America’s calculus-focused curriculum fails the top math students.)
Wait, what? Are you saying you did a ninth grade honors class in sixth grade?
I’m in the advanced maths class (we don’t have honors and AP classes here) and am going into ninth grade. We did algebra this year, and the last thing we did was quadratic expressions. Year 9 looks slightly boring except for *squee* Trigonometry, but Year 10 math looks wonderful. *runs about in circles*
Yeah… I’ve usually been a few years ahead in math. I could have done calculus freshman year if I had wanted. Instead, I’ve learned quite a bit of logic and combinatorics. (I’m a proud opponent of the calculus trap, in case you couldn’t tell.) I’m starting calculus this semester.
Actually, in my district, the typical track is:
9th grade: Geometry
10th grade: Algebra 2
11th grade: Precalculus
12th grade: Calculus
There are students above and below this, though. I’m taking Precal this year, as a sophomore. I have a friend, also a sophomore, taking Geometry. But the above is what the majority do.
Technically, algebra 1 is the typical freshman course. Of course, probably anyone posting on MB would be in the category of honors students who are at least a year ahead of the norm. But I know that math competitions that are supposed to be accessible to everyone can’t go beyond algebra 1 for freshman, geometry for sophomores, etc.
My course plan is
9th grade(current) Algebra II
10th grade Pre-Calculus
11th Grade Calculus AB
12th Grade Claculus BC
I’m wondering why you’d take calculus twice. Generally, BC covers all the material in AB; BC just covers it faster and covers extra material.
Giving in to peer pressure:
Summer before 9th grade: algebra I
9th grade: geometry
10th grade: honors algebra II
11th grade (current): honors precalculus
12th grade: NOTHING AT ALL! :D
In New York, over the past few years there were Math A and Math B exams, so instead of Algebra/Geometry/Trigonometry classes (which are coming back now) my school had Course 1-4 to teach us for the exams. There were a few tracks within that:
Regular level- Course 1 7th and 8th grade through 4 in 11th grade. Take the Math A after 2 and Math B after 3 or maybe 4? Then as a senior take Calculus, an introductory level course, or nothing since you’re only required to take three years of math
Honors- Course 1H 8th grade through 3H 10th grade year. Then, either take 4+ and then AP Calculus AB, or 4H and Calculus BC. The Math A exam is in January of 2H and the Math B is at the end of 3H. 4H was half a year of precalc and half a year of derivative calculus. I assume that 4+ is a full year of precalc. For comparison to the rest of the world- the SAT math level 2 subject test had a lot of stuff that I learned in 3H on it.
I took Course 1H when I was in seventh grade. My senior year, I’ll take Advanced Math Seminar, which meets after school a few times a month to learn bits of interesting things like multivariable calculus, and AP Statistics, the only other advanced math course in the school.
speller73- I read the article but, while you seem to have used it well, I don’t think it applies to all of us here, and saying that we shouldn’t take calculus because ZOMG IT’S A TARP is a misunderstanding. For most of us, taking calculus junior or senior year is surrounding ourselves with our peers, whom the school has also forced into taking the course, so the social aspect is irrelevant. Also, in my school at least, if I told a guidance counselor I didn’t want to take calculus they would say I was wasting my potential. There aren’t advanced courses that don’t require the use of calculus. Even if some college has them, I don’t have time after school to get my parents to drive me to a college (probably around half an hour away) twice a week for it. The guidance counselor is going to require that I take a math course that the school offers if I’m looking for something advanced and don’t know the material the course covers, so no matter how rewarding it is to do something else, I’m stuck at (or near) the top of my calculus class. (The math team’s good, though.)
Oh, that’s not how I interpreted the article. I mean, I’m all in favor of taking calculus junior or senior year. (I’m taking calculus this year, in fact.) My problem is when people are taking calculus before sophomore or junior year, when they barely know what probability is. The fact that someone would have rushed to calculus so quickly that they had never taken a simple geometry class bugs me.
Frankly, this really shouldn’t be a problem if someone is serious about math team, because good math team coaching should introduce students to combinatorics, number theory, contest-level geometry, etc. Not all math teams do this. When I did MathCounts in 8th grade, our coach (my dad, actually) gave us a variety of problems and went over any problem we had trouble with. Last year, our coaches handed us old tests and went to grade homework assignments. When I did ARML (if you know what that is) last year, our coaches would explain a topic to us, work through a few problems with us (not for us, with us), and then give us an ARML test that contained some problems on that topic. This year, it’s a bit of everything. Our coaches want to work with us, but since we usually get 20 or 30 people trying out for 5 spots, we need to spend most of our time on try-outs.
Anyways, math team makes me happy. (I spent all of tonight at ARML try-outs.)
Math team sounds way more competitive at your school than at mine.
We’re a part of the New York State Math League (nysml.com). I looked up ARML, it seems similar but not the same. We don’t have tryouts, we just have more teams of five. (There are A-E teams at my school. last year I got moved up from the D to C and then B team.) We also don’t meet to practice much, but when we do it sounds similar. The “tryouts” thing does remind me of MathCounts, though, way back when I used to do that.
This is a description of how NYSML is organized: Five meets once monthly October-February. Each has six questions for individual score and one team question/relay. Teams are ranked on sum of individuals plus team question/relay scores. March is a sectional meet, the top 20? teams go and compete for best team in our region (there’s also a lecture, last year’s was modular arithmetic.). Then, independent of the sectional results, two teams of the top 15 individuals in the region go to compete at the state meet.
Oh, NYSML. We had to do old NYSMLs for ARML practice.
For school math team, we have two local/state competitions, which are broken down by grade level and aren’t terribly difficult. They sound a bit like NYSML but differ in the details. Only so many people can compete for one grade, and we have a lot of people who want to do math team, so we wind up with a lot of try-outs.
ARML is different, because it’s not a school math team. Instead, it’s more like a regional all-star team. It’s fun. At least where I live, you have try-outs where they pick the regional team, and then if you make it, you have 4 practices at this one high school before you go to the actual competition, which is a 2 or 3 day trip.
Do you also do the AMCs?
ARML sounds somewhat like our state meet to me. (Except we don’t practice. And last year my region hosted it so it was a twenty minute drive away. This year, I think it’s an overnight trip, upstate somewhere.) It sounds fun.
I took the AMC 10 when I was in 9th and 10th grade, and am taking the 12 this year. They don’t give the 8 around here. We don’t practice for it as a team, and I really only look at old exams the night before in a futile attempt to cram. I don’t keep track of my scores as well as I should, either- I could find the old papers, but all I remember is that I scored somewhere in the eighties the first year and somewhere close to but below 100 the second year.
Let’s see…I think this is it.
Algebra I in 7th (I had to take a test to pass pre algebra where the hardest thing was the Pythagorean theorem.)
Geometry (Now) Honors in 8th Grade
Calculus AB/BC in 9th Grade.
I absolutely despise them. They were the horror of AP calc. *shudders* Bad memories. I’m sure I did them in other math, before that, but all I remember is they were one of the many things that were absolutely terrifyingly horrible when I took AP calc in highschool. In college, either we didn’t have much in the way of logarithms, or I actually managed to learn ’em, cuz I don’t remember any horrors of logarithms from that…..
Oh, they’re part of algebra? *utter and complete confusion*
You don’t really have the distinction here- it’s just a little bit of everything per year. This year is logarithms + messing about with powers (which we actually did already but not intensively) + functions, part the 3rd (I hope that’s the right translation) and their graphs + more about sines and cosines e.t.c. and their functions (new) + vectors in 3D + polarcoordinates and rotations (as in 790° angles) and a bunch of other stuff that I either can’t translate or forgot about or slept through (the teacher gives me a headache).
The problem is that you practically can’t take AP classes-everyone has to do everything in the same grade. But classes are pretty challenging anyway since our teacher’s elementary grasp of german is insufficient to explain anything *irritation* It’s very hard though; because while everything wants to get rid of her, test scores are normal because no-one wants to sacrifice their scores by neglecting their additional studying- you get help from your parents or get a tutor or ask your friends. I need to go rant now…
No! The math thread cannot die! Come back!
*agrees*
I just found out that I have a math research project for next year. I’m working with a math professor on set theory and/or logic.
(24.1) congratulations, speller!
Math is not my strong subject. In fact, it’s probably my weakest. I was turned off a career in science once I realized that it would involve lots of equations…And now, within the past couple of weeks, I’ve been considering it again. Biology doesn’t involve nearly as much math as physics.
f+h: AlpacaLips showed me a trick for remembering sine, cosine, and tangent. Uh.. Dad! Come over here! Help me explain this!
AlpacaLips: First explain what we were working on.
f+h: Right. I’m working on sine, cosine, and tangent. Seeing as it’s my mom’s worst enemy (Her words, not mine), I had to ask ‘Paca for help…
He showed me a shortcut for figuring out whether to multiply or divide, and also his way of remembering which is sine, which is cosine, and which is tangent… Dad, do I have to post this?
AlpacaLips: Yes.
f+h: 0_____________0
So…. Dad, what does the circle have to do with it?!?
*two hours and a lot of math and graphing and fiddling with the piano and Dad’s iPhone later*
….right.
I’m still not quite sure how sine, cosine, and tangent relate to a circle, but whatever. Dad’s trick:
Sine, cosine, and tangent relate to a cirlce. (?)
A soccer ball is a circle. (?!?)
Sine = opposite overhypotenuse (Soh)
Cosine = adjacent over hypotenuse (Cah)
Tangent = opposite over adjacent (Toa)
So we have “Soh cah toa”, which, according to ‘Paca, is “Soccer toe” if you say it with a Japanese accent. Right. So you remember sine, cosine, and tangent by the words “soccer toe”….
AlpacaLips: It makes perfect sense, doesn’t it?
f+h: I’m not so sure about that…
We used soh-cah-toa a lot in geometry, never heard it connected to “soccer toe” though, haha. The circle thing makes more sense when you get to the unit circle in pre-calc… and start using radians for EVERYTHING x_x
Math… I really want to get me AP test scores back >.< I took the Calculus BC exam, and I definitely didn’t do well on it (I test badly in math : / ), but I might have pulled a decent score for the AB subscore. I wish my test results better reflected my skills, because I actually like calculus, but I don’t want to have to take it again in college. *sigh*
Mr. Muchly Hated Geometry Teacher of Doomydeath says I proved that the base angles of an isosceles trapezoid are congruent in a way he’d never seen before. Which is amusing seeing as I only did it that way because I couldn’t remember how to prove it using parallel lines and triangles. Also, I was too lazy to prove that the base angles of an isosceles triangle are congruent. I hate oral exams.
Way it works is, you circumscribe the isosceles trapezoid. The base angles then intercept congruent arcs. Voila. I could explain it a lot better, but I’d need a blackboard and an actual interest in geometry beyond that of not failing the class.
Mr Muchly Hated Geometry Teacher of Doomydeath? I like that. Now, what could I call my maths teacher, who gives out so much homework she really ought to be teaching Commerce?
Anyone else interested in theoretical computer science? (Yes, this is really math.) You know, P vs NP and stuff. I’ve been taking a bunch of theoretical computer science here.
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