Philosophy and Ethics
Requested by niugnep.
Date: June 28, 2007
Categories: Ideas, Life, The Universe
Comments RSS TrackBack 150 comments
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1
Alice
in June 28th, 2007 @ 22:23You snipped it. I’m probably being annoying then. Sorry.
[Sorry, but it was totally irrelevant to the topic. –Rebecca]
[Alice, if you want to discuss other possible Kokonventions, feel free to do it on the existing Kokonvention thread. We’re trying to combat excessive thread proliferation. Thanks. –Robert]
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☻E☺2☻M☺B☻
in June 28th, 2007 @ 22:25I am the only person who actually exists. You are all just a show put on for my own amusement.
I’m kidding.
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Alice
in June 28th, 2007 @ 22:362- You stole that idea from Gwendolyn of the Eastern Seas.
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Alice
in June 28th, 2007 @ 22:371- I know. *does double take* You’re not talking in italics!
[Oops! Fixed it. End of a long day, I guess. –ReB]
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Beavo the Online Stalker
in June 28th, 2007 @ 23:02So…. what is this thread for……..
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☻E☺2☻M☺B☻
in June 28th, 2007 @ 23:58How do I know this world isn’t like the Matrix and we’re all sitting in pods while computers are calculating our imaginary lives out for us?
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Vixen of the Ruby Eyes of Drops of Gold
in June 29th, 2007 @ 04:47Is it ethical to have pets? Shouldn’t Chihuahuas be left to run wild like they did for 300+ year after the Aztecs vs. Cortez?
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Vixen in the Eyes of the Moon
in June 29th, 2007 @ 07:066- Because that’s the stupidest thing I’ve ever heard.
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Red-tailed HAWK
in June 29th, 2007 @ 07:54The world has gone MAD!!!!!!!!!!!!
And the only way stop this IS…*passes out-get help so I can finish!!!*
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Vixen in the Eyes of the Moon
in June 29th, 2007 @ 08:12*gives help* Now, how?
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rabbity24
in June 29th, 2007 @ 08:41isn’t ethics like not cheating on a test when there’s an opportunity? And philosophy is like thinking about big things like how the world was formed and is god real right?
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Vixen in the Eyes of the Moon
in June 29th, 2007 @ 08:49Ethics is the same as morals. It’s against my morals to cheat on a test, but it’s against the morals of the world to kill animals. So killing animals is unethical.
I give up. i’ll look it up.
got it:
1.
a. A set of principles of right conduct.
b. A theory or a system of moral values: “An ethic of service is at war with a craving for gain” Gregg Easterbrook.
2. ethics (used with a sing. verb) The study of the general nature of morals and of the specific moral choices to be made by a person; moral philosophy.
3. ethics (used with a sing. or pl. verb) The rules or standards governing the conduct of a person or the members of a profession: medical ethics.
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Alice
in June 29th, 2007 @ 11:046- Well, maybe it is. I doubt it, though. But even if it is like that, do we care? Why would we care? Our lives, even if they’re imaginary, are fun, right? Therefore, why does it matter?
12- But (and not to turn this into a vegetarian thread) it isn’t unethical for everyone. The way it is done into slaughterhouses is definitely unethical, but killing animals for meat or because they are in pain is not, as long as you have treated them well beforehand.
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Margaret
in June 29th, 2007 @ 11:45My friend and I used to have long discussions about whether or not we were just in some giant’s dream or something. We were probably like four based on my vague recollections of the location of said discussions.
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jammin j
in June 29th, 2007 @ 12:3614-u discussed the essence of reality when you were four? i’m impressed.
6-yeah, but if its true, then the computer calculating would MAKE you have that response to cover up our warped sense of reality and to prevent us from thinking ourselves out of our REM-life.
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Donaldo the supercoolio awesome nerd
in June 29th, 2007 @ 13:028-I agree.
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Elizabeth
in June 29th, 2007 @ 13:1212- it’s not against my morals to kill animals, and I’m part of the world
You know when they try to make themes of books say, like, “people are cruel and evil” (like the theme of The Chocolate War, such a dumb book) I think that’s just dumb, it’s not true and the author makes this little world to illustrate this “fact” and then we have to discuss it and write essays in school about this “fact” that isn’t true at all, I hate that. The author tries to sound all smart and all but it’s just wrong… grrr…..
people these days…
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niugnep
in June 29th, 2007 @ 13:34THANK YOU GAPAS!
7. If we didn’t keep chihuahuas and guinea pigs and hamsters and parakeets as pets there probably wouldn’t be any anymore. You are all doing them a big favor by feeding them and letting them live in your house and cleaning up after them. If I was an animal I would much rather live in a house with people who spoiled me than in the wild with predators and cold and have to work to find food. Being human, however, I don’t really care to work for the comfort of an animal.
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Vixen in the Eyes of the Moon
in June 29th, 2007 @ 13:4218- i partly agree with you. In fact I agree with all that you said about the last sentence. Not/care/about/an/animals/comfort?! Does that mean you would let a dogs in sever pain suffer and die in your front lawn with out twitching an eyelid?
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biblioRose
in June 29th, 2007 @ 13:47My personal philosphy(s)/ethics
1. Help others if you have the means
2. Do not harm anything uneccesarily
3. Take care of the enviroment
4. Don’t judge people or stereotype
5. Consider others opinions
6. Be respectful and polite
7. Stand up for what you believe in
8. Pursue your interests
9. Take time for fun and silly things
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Red-tailed HAWK
in June 29th, 2007 @ 13:4710-Thanks!
So the only way to stop this IS *click*
Okay I will say if anyone can tell me where I got the idea for that! Sorry, but I want to see if people know what I’m talking about…
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Vixen in the Eyes of the Moon
in June 29th, 2007 @ 14:1621- trhat stupid film “click”?
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Beavo the Online Stalker
in June 29th, 2007 @ 14:18Umm… Ethics. Hmm.
Be nice? I’m lost.
20-I think I do most of those… I think… what does that mean? Does that mean I’m perfectly pwnsome? *hope*
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Red-tailed HAWK
in June 29th, 2007 @ 14:1922-No, but yes, a motion picture of sorts…from a whole series…they were made before we were born.
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Alice
in June 29th, 2007 @ 14:2321- The only way to stop the madness is to get off the computer? To go to the fan page and click on Kokopelli? To buy something from the GAPAs? To subscribe to Click?
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Alice
in June 29th, 2007 @ 14:3524- Quatermass II?
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Piggy
in June 29th, 2007 @ 15:007-Ahhh, yes, the majestic wild chihuahuas, the spirit of Old Mexico. I can see them now, great herds of thousands of graceful creatures seen and heard from miles away, more grand than even the bison.
Sorry. Just feeling a little poetic today and wild chihuahuas struck me as funny.
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Vixen in the Eyes of the Moon
in June 29th, 2007 @ 17:0627- Think more of them quivering in small acves, hiding from hawks and eagles. But yes, it is a funny idea. Dont forget the roar that their tiny feet make as they pound across the gorund.
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biblioRose
in June 29th, 2007 @ 17:0827- Graceful? I’d never exactly thought of them that way…..
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cellogirl26
in June 29th, 2007 @ 18:28If anyone is an athiest, could they explain to me why? I might understand if they had a horrible tragedy that made them believe that god didn’t exist, but I like to look at my blessings (family, things to eat, clothes), and I know there must be a God.
p.s. I am a faithful Catholic
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The Insane Blue Sage
in June 29th, 2007 @ 19:1830- Maybe because they don’t really have any proof that God exists?
p.s. I’m not aetheist.
My only personal philosophy is never patronize and don’t sugar coat the truth.
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biblioRose
in June 29th, 2007 @ 19:3130- I am NOT an atheist but one of my friends is and her reason was because she didn’t have any proof, and if she did she wouldn’t care. I personally am inclined to agree with you.
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Momothebrainlesspig
in June 29th, 2007 @ 19:58Hello…? The Bible is proof. Unless, of course, you don’t believe the Bible. That’s another story…
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canon in D
in June 29th, 2007 @ 20:47cellogirl, I’m catholic, too! I thought I was the only one here.
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E2MB
in June 29th, 2007 @ 21:3834 – Did you know that Beavo the Great, Piggy, and I are all Catholics too?
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Vendaval
in June 30th, 2007 @ 11:25You can’t really prove that God exists, so some people see it as God not existing because terrible things happen/ they don’t see God. I think others hope that life is more than a test. I believe in one God who’s spoken through Abraham and following prophets, but you can call me a Christian.
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Red-tailed HAWK
in June 30th, 2007 @ 12:20But I thought the Muses were the ones who are helping people!!!
Maybe the closest thread to this discussion is this one
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38
Lawrence of Antarctica
in June 30th, 2007 @ 12:33Huh. I’m an atheist. It just doesn’t make sense to me that an invisible, all-powerful being controls every aspect of our lives.
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Lawrence of Antarctica
in June 30th, 2007 @ 12:352- No, we are all illusions in the head of one Aidan Meighan, who died when he ate Ibusneque’s (one of my friends) poison cinnamon crumblette and died. His hell is living with us!!!
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Mirabelle the divine Qween of Green
in June 30th, 2007 @ 12:58Well I go to a Methodist church, but the past years I have been questioning things. How can we prove anything, really? How do we know for sure that things actually exist? That is called faith, which apparently I have not much of. What if there are alternate realites, exactly the same as our own, but different. ( as in: There is a counterpart of you who is a boy, b/c when you were born there was a 50/50 chance you would be a girl. For every 50/50 chance another reality breaks off.) A ggod book for alternate realities is A Crack i nthe Line.
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cellogirl26
in June 30th, 2007 @ 13:2333- Well, there are many ways of believeing the Bible. I don’t believe that Noah actually built an ark, I believe the message of the story. Just like Aesop’s fables- Do you actually believe that a tortise raced a hare, or just the message of the story? I believe the Bible was written to help us get something out of everyday existence.
I also do not believe that God controls everything. God gives us talents, and skills that we have to put forth to do the best we can. I don’t think we can blame god for wars or Global warming. WE caused those things.
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Sweet Melpomene
in June 30th, 2007 @ 13:3630- I’m something of an agnostic/atheist/non-denominational person. The no-proof thing is always a major part of it. And there’s also the fact that I’ve never really believed the myths I’ve heard. They just aren’t real, or even remotely believable. And I don’t feel the ridiculous need to explain favourable circumstances with “supernatural” beings/phenomenon. Things simply are. I am a realist. And, of course, there are the myriad inherent contradictions in pretty much every organized religion. In addition to being a realist, I am amazingly skeptical and cynical. Religions have long been used to explain the inexplicable. Well, now we have science. I am a scientist.
40- Is it good? I think we have it, but I’ve never read it.
What I do, philosophically and ethically:
Be calm.
If there is cause to not be so, eliminate it.
Chill.
Repeat.Hey, it works.
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rachael
in June 30th, 2007 @ 15:0240-finally someone addressed that! Religion is faith and the whole thing about faith is believing in something that can’t be proven, seen or touched, etc.
41 – Thank you!!!!! I know so many people who believe that God controls everything and then they go and blame Him when something goes wrong. Us corrupt humans are to blame for almost everything from global warming to whatever other “bad things” you can think of. God gave us free will to believe in Him or not, also. So I don’t condemn atheists. It’s their choice.
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Momothebrainlesspig
in June 30th, 2007 @ 16:1941- To be blunt, I believe every single word in the Bible. I see how you’re comparing it to the fables, but I don’t believe fables. No, of course I don’t believe the tortise really raced the hare. But to me that’s different.
So you believe that Noah building the ark is just like an example? Something made up? If so, just wondering, why?
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canon in D
in June 30th, 2007 @ 16:4842. Name some of the contradictions of Christianity. I’m just wondering how others see my faith.
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Elizabeth
in June 30th, 2007 @ 17:00this is turning into the never-ending religion topic, doesn’t it ever get old to some people?
What do you think forms a person’s ethics?
sure, their environment and family, but there are people that grew up in a normal household and turned “bad” and the other way around, so, there has to be something else to it
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dark duke of darkness
in June 30th, 2007 @ 19:0745-oooh man. fun!
well, first of all, theres the thou shalt not kill. and then theres a giant list of things like this
“When they came to the threshing floor of Nodan, Uzzah reached out his hand to the ark of God to steady it, for the oxen were making it tip. But the Lord was angry with Uzzah; God struck him on that spot, and he died there before God. ”
and this….Yes, keep the Sabbath day, for it is holy. Anyone who desecrates it must die; anyone who works on that day will be cut off from the community. Work six days only, but the seventh day must be a day of total rest. ”
also, all gay people need to die! (according to God, of course)
Even the women turned against the natural way to have sex and instead indulged in sex with each other. And the men, instead of having normal sexual relationships with women, burned with lust for each other. Men did shameful things with other men and, as a result, suffered within themselves the penalty they so richly deserved. When they refused to acknowledge God, he abandoned them to their evil minds and let them do things that should never be done. Their lives became full of every kind of wickedness, sin, greed, hate, envy, murder, fighting, deception, malicious behavior, and gossip. They are backstabbers, haters of God, insolent, proud, and boastful. They are forever inventing new ways of sinning and are disobedient to their parents. They refuse to understand, break their promises, and are heartless and unforgiving. They are fully aware of God’s death penalty for those who do these things, yet they go right ahead and do them anyway. And, worse yet, they encourage others to do them, too. (Romans 1:24-32 NLT)
oh , and did you have sex before you were married? prepare to be stoned to death(of course, this only goes for women, men can do whater the #$%^ they want)
But if this charge is true (that she wasn’t a virgin on her wedding night), and evidence of the girls virginity is not found, they shall bring the girl to the entrance of her fathers house and there her townsman shall stone her to death, because she committed a crime against Israel by her unchasteness in her father’s house. Thus shall you purge the evil from your midst. (Deuteronomy 22:20-21 NAB)
little children suck. KILL THEM!
Numbers 31:17 (Moses) “Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every women that hath known man by lying with him.â€
…and, of course, my personal favorite. psalm 137:9
NASB: How blessed will be the one who seizes and dashes your little ones Against the rock. (NASB ©1995)
GWT: Blessed is the one who grabs your little children and smashes them against a rock.(GOD’S WORD®)
two translations!
okay, i could go on to blatant contradictions, and+tons of other evil stuff, but i think you get my point. if your’re a literalist, and you have reead the bible all the way through, i cant really see how you cant be evil. unless you didnt quite catch that part about the slaughter of small children?
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dark duke of darkness
in June 30th, 2007 @ 19:08oh, btw, sorry if i horribly offended anyone. but i was quoting for the bible, you know.
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niugnep
in June 30th, 2007 @ 19:21Atheism:
Most of you said that atheists cite the lack of proof of a God as their reason for not believing in one. I would replace the word “proof” with “evidence.”
Contradictions to Christianity (45):
We talk a lot today about the evolution debate, but we forget about another situation in which science contradicted the bible in a big way. I speak of the debate in the sixteenth century over whether the sun revolved around the earth or the other way around. I don’t think that was what you were looking for, but it’s a little food for thought.
46. Your question brings to mind the book Brave New World by Elspeth Huxley, which I highly recomend. It’s premise is a futuristic society in which every person has likes and dislikes “taught” to them using conditioning, kind of like how we train animals. I think this is kind of like how morals are taught to us. We aren’t given a lot of reasons. I made the connection (not in the reading strategy sense, in the real thinking sense) to Ayn Rand’s writings. Ayn Rand believed that we should reject traditional morality because one can’t arive at it through logic. She advocated extreme individualism- you look out for yourself and if others not as smart or well off as you can’t take care of themselves they deserve it. I dissagree with her premise- I think that one has to help and support other people because that’s how society works. I don’t lie to other people, defraud them, and I even give them help sometimes and I get much the same in return. It works.
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Red-tailed HAWK
in June 30th, 2007 @ 19:43Uhoh, looks like another religions thread is brewing…
Lets make up a story to explain this…
If I was to observe how people behaved in my town, and wrote down a few little notes but kept the rest in my head, and passed this down to my children, and they passed it to their children, and then they got around to telling some other people about it, and they all went off and tried to write books about it, would it be better evidence than, say, security camera footage of people walking around then? You can’t take things literally when they were written down a century after they happened! And it would have gone through more people, because they didn’t live as long back then…Can you see how things would get dilluted?
I’m not trying to insult anyone here, I’m just saying I don’t see how much can be true after that much time…
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♥ cellogirl26 ♥
in June 30th, 2007 @ 19:5744-So, despite scientific evidence, you believe God created the world in a week? A snake talked to them?? Jesus actually rose from the dead??? Every WORD????
47&50-So true…O.K., athiests. If you don’t believe in a God or a set of rules, what is stopping you from stealing or mudering (I’m NOT trying to say you do do these things)? If you won’t be punished for them??? What is keeping the workd from chaos? Pure smarts (look at our President-the C average student and PROUD of it)????
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E2MB
in June 30th, 2007 @ 20:4451 – I think you meant to say 46&50-So true…
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biblioRose
in June 30th, 2007 @ 21:25This isn’t good. This is the reason why we don’t have religion threads anynore! This isn’t about ethics it’s about making eachother feel bad about their beliefs! Could we discuss something else please?
Like pythagoras. He worshiped the number ten.
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Rebecca Lasley (Administrator)
in June 30th, 2007 @ 21:38(51) Setting the religious aspect aside for a moment, do you think fear of punishment is the only reason people don’t steal or murder?
By the way, the correct spelling is atheist or atheism — from a + theos, meaning “without god”; it does not mean “without a set of rules.” Discussion will be easier if we keep our terminology straight.
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dark duke of darkness
in June 30th, 2007 @ 23:5053-deal. just noticing you didnt respond to me….no. im really stopping.
51-yeah, basically what rebecca said. i dont steal beyond very small thigs and from my parents because i believe it would hurt them. i dont murder—same reason. i do not wish to harm others, because that would suck for them. basically. i recognize that otehr people are human, and feel exactly the same way i do. somewhat. anyhoo, because i can recognize this, i am human, or at least taht is one of the things that makes me human. this unwillingness to hurt others is called morals. i dunno if youve heard of them. it does make me wonder…if religious people only dont do “evil” becuse they want to get into heaven, arent they really not very good people.?(d’oh! stop criticizing religion!)anyhoo. im sure most of you religious people also believe in not doing evil for the same reasons i do. so yeah. those are my moral beliefs. if it will hurt someone (and i obviously dont just mean immediate physical pain(for example, if someone is in extreme pain, and they ask me to kill them, i probably wont because the pain will go away. if it will hurt someone, i wont do it to them, basically because i know how they feel. so i dont, for the most part. sometimes i do things that i know are wrong, for personal gain and satisfaction. (i.e torturing my brother.) so dont do anything that will hurt anyone else. and that is basically my entire moral code, and i dont really think anymore than that is necessary at all. anyone disagree? if so, why? please, do tell.
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dark duke of darkness
in June 30th, 2007 @ 23:5153-oh, and sorry for the double post, but ten seems like a reasonably harmless thing to worship, considering your options.
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♥ cellogirl26 ♥
in July 1st, 2007 @ 08:5052-I’m pretty sure I meant what I said.
53-Yeah, I probably should get off this topic now.
54-Sorry, I got kind of excited.
55- Hmmm, thanks for spelling it out for me…I’ll think about that.I think I was being kind of a jerk… sorry.
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E2MB
in July 1st, 2007 @ 10:0254 – What about the people that DO steal and murder? I wonder what they have to say about moral codes and fear of punishment?
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59
violindino
in July 1st, 2007 @ 11:5544: Do you believe things that are not ever mentioned in the bible? Like, dinosaurs, for instance? There was a girl in my class whose mom wouldn’t let her go to the natural history museum for a field trip because there were dinosaurs and “they aren’t mentioned in the bible.”
Of course, the bible was written a LONG time ago, and through many translations things have probably gotten changed and/or forgotten.
58:They have twisted codes that only make sense to them.
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widdershins (e~a)
in July 1st, 2007 @ 12:5654- No, it’s not the only reason. Personally, I don’t steal and murder because I believe it is wrong to steal and murder not because I think I’d be punished for it. If you only don’t murder and steal because of fear of punishment (by a god/gods, the government, etc.) it seems less good than if you just don’t do it because you believe it’s wrong.
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biblioRose
in July 1st, 2007 @ 13:2247/55- I don’t mean to be rude, but It is called interpertation. For example they are not saying you should kill/hurt your kids they are saying you should discipline them. Remember everything is not always going to be clear and some terms are masked.
56- I know it’s harmless it’s just his reasons seemed silly.
I think a lot of my ethics are influenced by my faith.
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Sweet Melpomene
in July 1st, 2007 @ 13:3845- Wow, DDoD seemed to take care of that for me. o_O
51- No. It’s just rude. I wouldn’t appreciate someone stealing from/murdering me, so I wouldn’t do it to them. Conversely, is the fear of “divine” punishment the only reason theists don’t do the same thing? And the hope for “rewards” in the “afterlife?”
60- Agreed.
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Momothebrainlesspig
in July 1st, 2007 @ 15:4851- Oops, sorry, I guess I wasn’t thinking straight when I said that. *blushes* I’m an old earth person. So no, I don’t believe that God created the world in a week. But, yes, Jesus rose from the dead (what do you believe?), and the snake talked to them.
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kricket
in July 1st, 2007 @ 16:16Okay, I kinda just skimmed through the whole thread and it looks like that everyone is debating Religion. And Christianity. Stuff like that. Eh. Anyways, food for thought and some answers to probably no one’s questions.
1) Time in the Bible is really confusing, don’t you think? I think so. In Genesis, remember how God created everything in like 7 days? I know, you’re thinking that can’t possibly happen? What about the dinosaurs!? That’s what I thought until my dad explained it to me. (It took him a week to figure it out.) A day back then when the world was created was actually not as short as the days are today. In fact, a day could be a few million years. This explains the dinosaurs. He probably created them 65 million years before humans, like science has proven. Kinda. 65 million years to us might just be a day to Him. And maybe he had to improve the animals and plants and stuff and that may have taken a big part of the “day”. Maybe he even improved us from cavemen. (We are not evolved from monkeys. I refuse to believe I am related to a filthy primate. Sorry to anyone I offended.) And remember how long people seemed to live in the Bible in the Old Testament and stuff? 1000 years or something, right? Well, I think that time was shorter then and the years were definately shorter than our years today.
2) What exactly is right and wrong? If you really think about it, right and wrong are just what people think (in other words, they’re just people’s opinions.). Like people say stealing is bad, but some people might have to steal in order to LIVE. Basically, isn’t right and wrong just what the law tells you to do? Hehe, food for thought.
3) And also, what is normal? Again, people’s opinion. Like some people might not consider carrying around a towel on towel day is normal. They might think you rather weird. But you probably wouldn’t. And some people might also think that being very short is weird or very very tall is weird. Those people might not though. Food for thought again.
4) What do you base your opinions on? A book, the government, the law, Hollywood, movie stars, celebrities, movies, what the general public thinks, etc.? How many of your opinions do you really have that are originally your own? Isn’t it almost impossible to have an original opinion? Especially with the world we live in today! Hehe… makes you think doesn’t it?
*DISCLAIMER* These are my own thoughts and opinions and if you find any offense in them then I do not take responsibility for them etc etc etc… I’m sure by now you know what a disclaimer is right? Good. Then I don’t have to explain anymore.
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kricket
in July 1st, 2007 @ 16:1763- See the first point of my last post please.
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kricket
in July 1st, 2007 @ 16:19Was that philsophy or just me writing random points on life? Or is writing on random points of life philosophy??? Confusing…
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biblioRose
in July 1st, 2007 @ 18:2564- I agree on almost all points. Thank you for addressing those things!
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The Queen (of Music, Math, and Hippies) formerly cellogirl26
in July 1st, 2007 @ 18:51I have some philisophical questions that I think are interesting to consider…
~Why are we on this earth?
~Why does death exist?
~What would happen if we were all immortal??
We discussed some of these questions in reading class over the book Tuck Everlasting…
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69
Alice
in July 1st, 2007 @ 19:03My philosophy, summed up in one easy word:
WRITE.Ta-ta!
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70
dark duke of darkness
in July 1st, 2007 @ 20:1464-aww man. i so wanna answer that. but i cant… i would have to be mean. meh. ill compromise. only answering one thing related to religion.
“(We are not evolved from monkeys. I refuse to believe I am related to a filthy primate.” first of all. primate is a classification of species. you are not only related to a primate, you ARE a primate. second, APES, not monkeys. third, chimpanzees share 94% Of our DNA. personally, i would classify that as related. or dont you believe in DNA? and fourth, your reaction is exactly the same as that of scientists when darwin published his paper. “i cant be related to these things! they’re animals! im BETTER than them.” sorry abour being mean. im moving on now. dont really want to have another evolution thread.64(2)- well, right and wrong are what i say they are. and of course most of the rest of the world. as i said, wrong is hurting others. right…is a bit more complicated. but it doesnt matter nearly as much, at least from amoral standpoint. and the law certainly isnt whats right. the law is what the government says it is. and in amny cases i disagree with the government.
3-normal… is what the majority of the population of an area thinks it is. otherwise its what you think it is.
4-my surroundings, what i know, and my morals. i.e, i think the war in iraq is a bad thing, because i know that many people are dieing for no important or even helpful reason, and i feel(moraly) that that is wrong.
68-we’re on this earth cause its a nice place. no, really. perfect enviroment for life.
death is the absence of life. it would be fairly obvious why death exists, the question is why life exists.
if we were all immortal umm. probably gross overpopulation. and people would have to kill each other a lot because of that overpopulation.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
61-well, first of all the smash the children against the rocks is not about your own children, it about the children of babylon. revenge. not discipline, revenge. burning down houses and smahing children. or maybe…. umm. in a different interperetation, egging their houses and disciplining their children? seriously.
also, “But if this charge is true (that she wasn’t a virgin on her wedding night), and evidence of the girls virginity is not found, they shall bring the girl to the entrance of her fathers house and there her townsman shall stone her to death, because she committed a crime against Israel by her unchasteness in her father’s house. Thus shall you purge the evil from your midst.”
maybe ill interpret that ass umm…. nn virgins cant get married. not that they should be stoned to death, but if evidence can not be found of a female’s virginity, they cant get married. that sounds fair, doesnt it? or would you interpret it another waY?
anyhoo, about your comment i said literalists are evil. LITERALISTS. that means no interpretation. LITERALISTS.
sorry to be mean. please respond though.
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71
biblioRose
in July 1st, 2007 @ 21:16I have a philisophical question to pose: If you were given the choice to drink water from a spring (is this starting to sound familiar?) that enabled you to live forever would you? I wouldn’t. Oh yes, and it would also keep you at the age you are.
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72
Alice
in July 1st, 2007 @ 21:2171- No.
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73
Momothebrainlesspig
in July 2nd, 2007 @ 10:2864- I read it. I really liked it. Thanks.
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74
E2MB
in July 2nd, 2007 @ 10:4264 – Kriket! So nice to see you! Good post. *thumbs-up*
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75
E2MB
in July 2nd, 2007 @ 10:4371 – *gasp* NEVER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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76
agagabagabag
in July 2nd, 2007 @ 16:2812- You have to kill animals to survive, therefore it aint unethical.
30- The real tragedy is that most of the people on earth are under a spell to follow an organizaton that prevents knowledge.
From my book:
I have a little theory that I call the Vatican theory. The pope seems like a reasonably bright person, but the Abrahamic religions preach stupidity, or rather that knowledge is bad. The pope and cardinals preach stupidity, while taking advantage of other people’s submission to gain power. They probably don’t even believe in what they teach. These luxury loving power trippers date back to Jesus, who gained followers from the flock of John the Baptist by promising them eternal life, and then reaping the rewards of his newfound political power. The myth of him being the son of god originated after his death. At first, Christians hated the Romans and blamed them for Jesus’ death, but the blame suddenly was transferred to Jews when the Christianity became the official religion of the Roman Empire. This ridiculousness forms what two billion people believe, and nothing good can come out of that.
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77
rachael
in July 2nd, 2007 @ 16:3347 – God never said all gay people had to die. Paul the apostle said that. HE wrote the epistles, not God. Paul was human and didn’t always have the right idea as humans are bound to do. I am a Christian and I dont’ believe all gays and lesbians have to die. I wouldn’t choose that lifestyle but they certainly can. I don’t care. taht’s there buisness not mine.
And anyway, what happened to Jesus taking all the little children to him when his disciples tried to push them away? Jesus loved kids. And as we all believe killing is wrong, christians or no, not one of us would actually want to kill little kids. And it was the E’domites not David (he wrote the psalms) who were saying that. You took that quote COMPLETELY out of context.
71 – no way. never. If we were all immortal we’d have all our parents and grandparents and great-great granparents, etc, to deal with. And alot of people would only get stuff done halfway. We were discussing this in English class in May but I can’t remember much else…. we got a bunch of time-related things to think about from this book called Einstien’s Dreams. It’s really good. go read it.
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78
rachael
in July 2nd, 2007 @ 16:4276 – are you aware that there is a different branch of Christianity not under the Pope? I belong to it. It’s called Eastern Orthodoxy. Roman Catholocism came out of that and the Protestant denomenations came out of catholicism (how do you spell that ?) And most christians (hopefully) don’t have anything against Jews. Us Eastern Orthodox certainly don’t.
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79
kricket
in July 2nd, 2007 @ 18:3970- I’m not related to a ape or a monkey or whatever. Have you ever thought that God had designed monkeys to share some of our DNA to genetically help them survive? Last time I checked, monkeys are doing pretty well in the world. I think.
A question: why are you trying so hard to destroy other people’s faith? Isn’t it enough that you destroyed your own faith? Do you really have to go around destroying other people’s faith?
Let me guess. Democrat.
71- No. I want to live the rest of my life normally and get the chance to experience things. Plus, if you know you’re going to die eventually, then wouldn’t you enjoy life better than if you weren’t ever going to die? I think so.
73- Welcome. And Thanks!
74- Thanks, good to see you too!
77/78- Great points.
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80
kricket
in July 2nd, 2007 @ 18:42New question~ Who here thinks Global Warming is actually real and happening? I for one, do not. It’s just a cycle. I’ve stated my opinion. *Note* OPINION.
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81
The Queen (of Music, Math, Penguins and Hippies)
in July 2nd, 2007 @ 18:5271-Maybe…hmmmmmmmmm……I’ll get back to you on that
80- I think Global Warming is DEFINITELY happening. Have you seen an Inconvenient Truth? You should. It is mind-bending!
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82
biblioRose
in July 2nd, 2007 @ 19:3877- Thanks You! Excellent points!!!!!!!!!!!!
80- I think it could be a combination fo both.
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83
dark duke of darkness
in July 2nd, 2007 @ 20:2076-not that im a vegetarian, but i have plenty of friends who are, and they seem to be living….yeah. killing animals is unethical. i do it anyway, because they taste good.
71-umm yes. im a necrophobe. i dont really think i would enjoy life more knowing that im going to die. i try not to think about the fact that i am going to die.
81-uhh yes. agree completely. but i really dont want to go over that again…..
77-however,
Leviticus 18:22
“Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination.” i’m not a biblical scholar, but that seems pretty anti-gay. and since the bible is the word of god… (yes, i am aware that one can interpret the bible in many ways. just pointing out what it says.)
77-i’m sure jesus loved kids. the bible is a very hypocritical thing. and about the quote, would you like to see it in context?
1 By the rivers of Babylon we sat and wept
when we remembered Zion.
2 There on the poplars
we hung our harps,
3 for there our captors asked us for songs,
our tormentors demanded songs of joy;
they said, “Sing us one of the songs of Zion!”
4 How can we sing the songs of the LORD
while in a foreign land?
5 If I forget you, O Jerusalem,
may my right hand forget its skill .
6 May my tongue cling to the roof of my mouth
if I do not remember you,
if I do not consider Jerusalem
my highest joy.
7 Remember, O LORD, what the Edomites did
on the day Jerusalem fell.
“Tear it down,” they cried,
“tear it down to its foundations!”
8 O Daughter of Babylon, doomed to destruction,
happy is he who repays you
for what you have done to us-
9 he who seizes your infants
and dashes them against the rocks.
(happy be them that avenge us, by smashing children’s heads on rocks. yeah.)
79-yeah. that is an easy way to win an argument, isnt it? god made it that way. one could simply say that about everything, and there would be no argument against it, except that god doesnt exist. but that would be a digression, so ill just leave it at god doesnt exist, so he didnt create chimpanzees.
and in answer to your question, first of all i never ahd any faith. it would be impossible for me to have any, unless my parents told me to. which, they didnt. when i unavoidably was confronted witht he idea of god, i thought that noone could have believed in that since the middle ages. my parents told my that, no that was not the case, 80% of the country still believed in it. i asked them if god existed, they wouldnt answer. and faith is a bad thing.it really is. what if a doctor decided that s/he would have faith in bleeding. ne cannot prove that it works, but they have faith that it does. so in comes the pneumonia patient, and out goes their blood. and they die. but the doctor said, we did everything we could. what sets the bible apart from….say…his dark materials, or any alternate world novel? what makes the bible more true? (assuming of course that we didnt know who wrote his dark materials.) and…no. you’re wrong. i’m not a member of any party, it happens to be illegal for people under 18 to be. however, i would definately vote for any democrat over a republican.
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84
Robert Coontz (Administrator)
in July 2nd, 2007 @ 21:53Let’s change the subject away from religion, shall we?
Here’s something that might be interesting to discuss. When I was in college, one of my philosophy teachers thought that all people around the world (except individuals who are insane or otherwise defective) share the same basic ideas about what is right and what is wrong. So why do they act differently? we asked. His reply: Because they have different beliefs not about morality, but about the world.
“For example,” Professor O. said, “how many of you think that it’s wrong to burn a witch?”
All of us raised our hands.
“No, you don’t,” he said. “Not if you define a witch as someone who consorts with evil spirits and who has the power to curse you and your children to an eternity of torment after death. What unimaginable horror! If someone like that were living in your neighborhood, of course you’d want to get rid of her, the quicker the better. Your children’s souls would be at stake. Burning would be too good for her!
“The reason you don’t burn witches is that, unlike people in the Middle Ages, you don’t believe that there are any witches. You don’t think anyone has the power to do the things that witches were supposed to do. You aren’t morally different from the witch-burners — you just have a different belief about the way the universe is.”
(He wasn’t just talking about witches. That was just an extreme example he cited to make his point.)
Thirty years later, I’m still not sure whether Professor O. was right, wrong, or partly right. What do you think?
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85
Alice
in July 2nd, 2007 @ 21:56My philosophy:
Maturity is not gaged by how long you have been alive, or whether you have reached such-and-such a developmental stage, but whether or not you pick fruit before it’s unripe.
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86
widdershins (e~a)
in July 2nd, 2007 @ 23:4371- Nope, I wouldn’t. But in the book, they didn’t either. They drank from the spring and then discovered their immortality.
77- “I am a Christian and I dont’ believe all gays and lesbians have to die. I wouldn’t choose that lifestyle but they certainly can. I don’t care. taht’s there buisness not mine.” Okay, your point is fine, I’d just like to point out that one does not choose ones sexual orientation. You don’t choose to be attracted to members of the opposite sex, that’s just the way you are.
(same post different comment) “we got a bunch of time-related things to think about from this book called Einstien’s Dreams. It’s really good. go read it.” ooh, that’s one of my choices for a reading assignment this summer!85- oh, I love that. That is a nice philosophy.
Global warming is happening. There is lots of scientific evidence and research that backs up the ideas that global warming exists.
And yes, we are primates. Why do you want to pretend that we aren’t?
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87
dark duke of darkness
in July 3rd, 2007 @ 01:3786-thanks.
84-umm i’d just like to point out that i would not burn anyne. or, at least i think that i wouldn’t. point is, burning people is wrong, whether they ate one’s child’s soul or not. and, therefore i would like to think that i am morally different from said witch burners. killing people is wrong, regardless of what they have done. (even if they are witches and not people.)
..and who burned wiitches?…. *hits self in head* you all can just ignore that. religion is now off topic, because some people are religious.
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88
Vixenin the Eyes of the Moon
in July 3rd, 2007 @ 05:5584- That’s rather interesting. I think he’s right. I can’t really explain it.
ok, I really don’t want to start another religous flame war, but i looked at all the responses to 30, and I really didn’t find one that pleased me. sooooo…..
30- After my father died, I was a devoit Lutheran. Went to church every sunday, and did as much as the preacher told me to do as a 5 yearold could do. Then we went backpacking in Asia for six months. I encountered hundreds, if not more, people who were as devoit as I was, but to different religions. And my eight year old self thought, “Are all these people wrong? Are they going to burn in hell for all eternity?” I wasn’t really tinking about the adults, but there was that girl down the road from our hotel we stayed at that I played with all day, every day. i had gone to her house for dinner, we walked around the neighborhood to the playground, we cut all of our barbies’ hair, we played king of the hill with her twin brother, etc. And I really couldn’t believe that she and her family were going to be tortured for ever.But then I thought, welll if they aren’t going to go to hell, then am I wrong? Is their religion the right one? And how do I tell the difference between the right ones and the wrong ones? What about the stray dog that all the kids feed? Is it christian? does god love it? If he does, then why doesn’t it have a nice christian family and get fed chicken every night? And so on and so on. I became less and less christian with every country we went to, until at last I was officially agnostic. I thought about whether hinduism was the right religion, but it felt as fake as christianity had. Finally I just thought, “Well, this is stupid, all the religions are wrong! I die, and it’s all over!” And in my heart, I knew that I was satisfied with that answer, and I was a little sad, because it meant that I would never see my father or my pet goldfish again, but at least I din’t have to worry about going to hell anymore. I think that since I became an atheist, I’ve lived my life alittle more wilder, taking chances and opening any doors that I ever came across because I knew that it was the only life that I was ever going to live. And to me, that’s perfectly all right.
Now, I really don’t want people to respond to that. if 30 wants to say anything, I think that’s all right, but this is not a religions thread.If you had the power to make evryone agree on someting, what would it be? Would you use that power? if I did, it would haunt me for the rest of my life.
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89
biblioRose
in July 3rd, 2007 @ 11:2287- What if it’s in self-defense? What if someone is about to kill/severly harm you and you have a way of stopping them? Is that morally right to you?
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90
agagabagabag
in July 3rd, 2007 @ 12:4483- They kill the bugs that live on the plants they eat.
88- That’s beautiful. Really beautiful.
I’m an ape! Are you calling my (and your) cousins filthy???
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91
dark duke of darkness
in July 3rd, 2007 @ 13:2689-depends on the situation. if i am presented with the (however unlikely) situation of s/he’s gonna kill you unless you kill him/her right now!, i would do it, but it would still be wrong.in real situation, si would y’know, try to restrain person, or like shoot them in the leg or something. and shooting someone in the leg to prevent them from killing you is the right thing to do, if it is the least hurtful way you can prevent your own/someone elses death. regarding other people, if there’s some psycopath dude with a gun about to kill more than one person, and the only way to stop them is to kill them, then that would be the right thing to do.
90-do bugs count as animals? and not necessarily. organic food doesnt get sprayed with bug killer, and if i big gian hand reached down to your house, would you run away, or just hang out there? i dont think the bugs would either. anyway, assumng bugs are animals, you could live in a glass bubble without bugs. point is, you have to draw the line somewhere at what one is willing to kill for food. i draw it at humans. vegetarians draw it at non-bug animals. point is, we certainly dont have to kill cows and pigs etc. etc. to survive, and therefore it certainly is unethical.
88-yeah. gopd for you.
90-well, i dunno when’s the last time you saw an ape take a shower?
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92
agagabagabag
in July 3rd, 2007 @ 14:0191- They ARE animals. And it’s perfectly natural to eat pigs and cows. And humans are apes by definition, so this morning.
78- It doesn’t matter. It’s the same story with your leaders.
Chapter fourteen in my philosophy book. I’ll post it when l’m done.
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93
Sweet Melpomene
in July 3rd, 2007 @ 15:2392- But it isn’t necessary. So why not let them live?
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94
rachael
in July 3rd, 2007 @ 15:2483- I actually did read that psalm, thank you.
86 – sorry. I didn’t know that you don’t choose your orientation.
Hey, I thought of something last night.This has nothing to do with ethics, morals, religion, or any of that stuff, just to warn everyone. My question to y’all is:
Is music still music even when it’s not being played/sung and it’s only written on the page? I say no, my dad says yes. What do you think?
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95
Ê‘yviva
in July 3rd, 2007 @ 15:29i have many comments to the religios posts, but this is NOT the thread for it. my uncle teaches philosophy and he opens the year by telling people that this is not the class to discuss the existance of gd. if they want that, there is a theology class down the hall.
i beleive the problems with the religous posts are
a) people argue about who is right with out offering logical backup
b) people are not respecting that other people have differing viewpoints.
c) people are attacking eachothers opinions, not debating them.
keep this in mind when you post. in addition, do not make comments about a religion if you are uninformed. i’m reading through these posts and i find people are interpreting things litterally when many people who beleive in the text they are quoting do not.
a final note that applies to this entire thread:
THIS IS PHILOSOPHY AND ETHICS. PEOPLE DISAGREE AND THAT IS OK. don’t fight about it forever. just agree to disagree.84- i think that, like everyone else, he is partly right. the toher thing to consider is the stress placed on different belifs. for exmple, take killing and stealing. most people consider murder worse than theft, and so would probably not accept killing theives. if however, you thought theivery was worse, you probably would.
I have two ethical questions for everyone:
1. you were wakling next to some railroad tracks and some random stranger was on the tracks. a train is coming up behind him. through whatever means, you KNOW that the train will crash and everyne in it will die if it does not hit the stranger. if it hits the stranger, the stranger will be the only casualty.
Do you warn him to get off the tracks?
2. Same situation as 1, but this time the stranger is walking next to you.
Do you push him onto the tracks?in both cases, assume you are not large enough to stop the train, so suicide would be pointless.
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96
biblioRose
in July 3rd, 2007 @ 15:3191- I think it’s natural for humans to eat meat if they want to. It is in a humans system to want to eat meat, unless they are flukes who like me, hate the taste. If you think about we are keeping species alive because we need them for food. I don’t eat meat for that reason, but it sort of seems to me that it is the food chain and cows/chickens pigs etc. would set that chain out of wack if everyone stopped eating them. I wouldn’t mess with the laws of nature. Oh, yes and I eat chicken broth.
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97
Ê‘yviva
in July 3rd, 2007 @ 15:3294- yuor question is on topic, because it has a lot to do with philosophy. in this case, i agree with you beacue is view music as a sound. i think sheet music is just potential music.
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98
Vixen in the Eyes of the Moon
in July 3rd, 2007 @ 15:42No. Music is sound and is nontransferable into the visable. It is instructions for music.
87- I agree killing people is wrong. Just like capital punishments, but I don’t feel like elaberating.
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99
E2MB
in July 3rd, 2007 @ 16:1388 – Read The Last Battle by C. S. Lewis. In it, Emeth, who is a devout follower of a false religion, gets saved in an interesting way.
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100
Vixen in the Eyes of the Moon
in July 3rd, 2007 @ 16:3399- Is emeth the donkey or the monkey? I can’t remember. I like the image of a unicorn with its horn dripping blood. It’s very good.
*does one hundreth post dance*
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101
widdershins (e~a)
in July 3rd, 2007 @ 16:5794- that’s okay, I just wanted to point that out.
95- gah! those are difficult questions! (the train ones…) I shall ponder them. Also, I agree with you on the agree to disagree thing. It is better if we don’t get too heated in our discussion so that it turns into an argument.
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102
rachael
in July 3rd, 2007 @ 16:5895 – 1. I suppose I would let the person keep on walking, because you would be sacrificing one life for the lives of, say, two hundred other people. It sounds cruel but the other choice would be to kill two hundred others. That’s a very hard question.
2. I would put myself on the track. If I pushed the other person on it’d be murder almost but sacrifice (or suicide) if you put yourself on… this question is even harder because it’s a choice between me or someone else. I wouldn’t want to die but at the same time I wouldn’t want to be a murderer. So is it better to kill yourself for a train full of people or to basically kill someone else?
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103
Capricious The Great and Terrible (cappy)
in July 3rd, 2007 @ 21:50You know what I would HATE? Is if I woke up, and I was three months old and my life was a dream I could VAGUELY remember. Wouldn’t that suck?
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104
agagabagabag
in July 3rd, 2007 @ 21:57102- You can’t put yourself on.
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105
Alice
in July 3rd, 2007 @ 22:05103- Definitely.
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106
Alice
in July 3rd, 2007 @ 22:09About the train thing.
1. I would make the stranger get off the tracks. Or I would just scream a warning and flee.
2. Run away. I wouldn’t say a thing to the stranger.I don’t have any illusions about my honor or bravery.
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107
Ê‘yviva
in July 3rd, 2007 @ 22:11102- why do you consider it murder in the second case and no the first? this is actually a standard responce. despite the fact that if the stranger dies the same amount of people are saved and the same one person dies, for some unexplainable reason, people tentd to be more comfterable through the passive action. does anyone have any ideas as to why?
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108
Alice
in July 3rd, 2007 @ 22:15107- Good point.
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109
dark duke of darkness
in July 3rd, 2007 @ 23:5693-i agree.and my answer is because they taste good. i know. morally reprehensible. but still.
96-cows, chickens and pigs are farmed by humans. that meanst that they’re unnatural. not part of the food chain. bad for the enviroment. use up tons of recources.
95-personally, i would probably keep walking in the first case, and not push in the second. but the right thing to do in both cases is to let one person dies as opposed to 200. and its murder in both cases, and if the one person does not die, its mass murder. its just much easier to do the right thing in the first scenario. why? umm.physically doing something is much more… immediate than just not doing something, causing something.
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110
Ê‘yviva
in July 4th, 2007 @ 09:38109- when you say murder i assume you mean in an ethical sence. doing nothing when you are not involved is not legally murder.
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111
Sweet Melpomene
in July 4th, 2007 @ 12:0995- Think like Spock. The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, or the one. Just, it wouldn’t be me on the tracks if the stranger were the person who absolutely needed to be hit.
109- However you can justify it.
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112
Rebecca Lasley (Administrator)
in July 4th, 2007 @ 12:19(95, et al.) Random strangers are one thing, what if the person is someone you know, someone you love?
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113
Ê‘yviva
in July 4th, 2007 @ 13:30112- even though intilectualy i understand that the train is more people, i couldn’t, even through inaction, allow someone i love to come to die. nor could i, through action, kill someone- even a random stranger.
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114
biblioRose
in July 4th, 2007 @ 14:10What if there was a large object you were able to put in front of it to stop the train? There are so many alternate possibilities based on pure chance that I would have to see those before picking either of those options.
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115
Jadestone
in July 4th, 2007 @ 14:1595- …I think I’d tell the stranger, and let them decide what to do with their life. And Iw ouldn’t judge them for whatever choice they made. If I couldn’t do this… I dunno.
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116
Alice
in July 4th, 2007 @ 14:31113- Exactly.
By the way, Zyviva, how did you do that to your name?
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117
Alice
in July 4th, 2007 @ 14:43When asked ethical questions regarding sacrifice, you have to be honest with yourself. The same with making your book characters. How many people are going to sacrifice themselves, even for the good of many? I wouldn’t.
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118
The Insane Blue Sage
in July 4th, 2007 @ 14:4795- 1st case, I think I’d try do do somthing to divert the stranger and if he/she didn’t respond, I’d do nothing.
2nd-do nothing, unless someone I knew was on that train.
112- save the person in both cases.
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119
Ê‘yviva
in July 4th, 2007 @ 14:56117- i agree. even though i know its probably better to sacrafice one for many, i couldn’t. i think it might have to do with our preceptions of reality. since i can’t see the people n the train, and all i would see would be a hunk of metal, my compassion would be for the living, breathing, real person.
(the ʑ is a symbol. in word its alt+657, but when i do that on museblog i get æ, so i copyed and pasted it)
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120
rachael
in July 4th, 2007 @ 15:41104- in that case I would keep walking like everyone else though I think it’d be kind of hard to do… maybe not.
107 – i would kind of consider it murder because if you pushed the other person on you would be causing them to die… which is murder. I guess. Now that I think about it, I don’t honestly know what I would do. It’s a split-second decision if that was in real life and one would make a choice based on instinct. In real life one wouldn’t have half an hour to think it through and then make a choice.
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Vixen in the Eyes of the Moon
in July 4th, 2007 @ 16:16I was thinking. For all of you people who said that you would let the person on the tracks keep walking, and the train of people live, what if the person walking on the track was your mom or dad, and the train was full of convicts?
These aren’t easy questions, and there aren’t any easy answers.
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dark duke of darkness
in July 5th, 2007 @ 16:28110-i know. you assume correctly.
112-uhh. that changes things. not whats right, but what i would do. in that case, i would save person, in both cases.
114-the situation is hypothetical. it is as close to impossible as anything get to have the situation in the first place. therefore, there are no other options.
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biblioRose
in July 6th, 2007 @ 13:18122- Excuse me, but There are always other options. I doubt this highly unlikely-hypothetical situation takes place in an abandoned remote place with only traintracks. And I don’t understand why you try so very hard to constantly disagree with me for whatever reason.
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Alice
in July 6th, 2007 @ 14:42Ack, ethics. Nearly as bad as metaphor.
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Ê‘yviva
in July 6th, 2007 @ 15:14123- the point of having so few options in the origanal question is to limit the amount of choices you can make. if there were so many choices, we would never be able to discuss why people chose what they did because there would be so many different answers. in probelms like these, the point is not what you do- the point is why.
if there was some way to do this that didn’t involve someone dying, than there would be no debate as to the ethics and philosophy behind the dission- which is the point of this topic.
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biblioRose
in July 6th, 2007 @ 18:54125- I know, thats just the way my mind works.
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dark duke of darkness
in July 8th, 2007 @ 20:35126-sorry about that. i wasn’t trying… i just disagree with you on most political issues.
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FrigidSymphony
in July 9th, 2007 @ 12:08There is nothing more important than myself. Ergo, everything I hold dear and is essential to my comfort gains importance as well. That means people I care for, the place I live in, etc.
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Ê‘yviva
in July 9th, 2007 @ 17:58128- what a very human attitude. the one thing you left out is the importance of pride.
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E2MB
in July 9th, 2007 @ 18:16129 – Why is the first letter of your name a square?
130 – What’s Ergo?
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agagabagabag
in July 9th, 2007 @ 23:50128- Uh huh. Uh huh. Sometimes l think that you may not be the best role model.
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100% cotton
in July 10th, 2007 @ 11:5176- maybe it is nessecary to kill animals to survive, but is it nessecary to kill so many? and did you know that if everyone in the world was vegetarian, we ciuld eliminate world hunger?
also, i just posted this on the hot topic thread but then i realized it should probably go here…
this is something a friend of mine who is currently in bolivia said, and i was just wondering what you thought about it.
“The night before last while staying with a wonderful family we had the amazing experience of hearing all about the world by an indigionous man by the name of Llewar (which in quechua means blood fire). This was my first experience in Bolivia that really turned my world upside down.
Here is some reflection on the conversation we had with him
all these are just questions and hypothetical conversations, and so please dont be offended or think i have fallen off the deep end.
The conversation was fully indescribable, but the word that pops to mind is inspirational. It was deep and philosophical but had the feeling of a common dialogue around the fire (where we were).We were all chewing coca leaves and listening to this incredibly wise man laying out all of his views infront of us, like saying ¨This is who I am, this is what I believe.¨
It made me question the US and the fact that they call these people who have SO much poor. These lines that he said will forever be ingrained in my memory.
” No somos pobre, no somos el tercer mundo, somos de el solo mundo, no necicitamos su ayuda.”
It basically translates to ” We are not poor, we are not the third world, we are part of the only world, we do not need your help”
These lines resinated with me so much that I nearly cried.
We talked about mindless consumers bred by power hungry corperations in a neo liberal and capitalistic society.
He really made me question which way of living i think is better, which is impossible to do for most americans when the western media reports in only one perspective and voice, The use the voice of “we need to help the third world become more like us” How arrogant can we be? Who are we to assert our views and methods of organizing society on a people who have been doin fine for thousands of years? It goes so far to even think about how we cant stand to say that we share a world with these people, since we call them the “third world” as Llewar said, there is only one world…our world.
Another question brought up is what is progress? I have recently discovered that EVERYTHING is relative. What we call happiness or quality of life is relative to our perspective and enviroment in and on the world. Is progress good? or is just subsistance enough? Why did I say “just” before subsistance? Isnt living enough?”
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Ê‘yviva
in July 10th, 2007 @ 14:00132- on a similar note:
people think progress occurs in a straigh line up, but it is incredably staggered.
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100% cotton
in July 10th, 2007 @ 14:16133- quite true.
also, i just noticed the fear of punishment quetion, so i shall yap about that.
i’m buddhist, kind of, and i think that human beings are essentially compassoinate. I think that maybe some people would steal and murder if there was no punishment, because they felt desperation or something along that line, but i think many people would be good just becuase that it the right thing to do. so yeah.
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dark duke of darkness
in July 10th, 2007 @ 23:30128-bliddy satanist! although i feel the same way… but only to a point y;know?i care about myself more, that doesnt mean i dont care about total strangers.
130-*tries very hard not to laugh* i hope you’re younger than me…. okay, that was mean.
134-i would be a buddhist if it were’nt for the annoying little part about reincarnation….
132-hmm. i can see your point. and yet…. subsistence is okay as long as its not subsistence because of our exploitation. to live a simple life is one thing. to be constantly worried about whether or not there is food to eat is another. i completely agree that we should nto force our culture upon others, but that does not mean taht exploiting them is okay. on the other hand, i like stuff. y’know? i need a wah pedal for my guitar, i need a new ipod, i need good food. the fact that these things are available to me is not a bad thing.
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biblioRose
in July 11th, 2007 @ 21:52135- I agree on that last bit. I don’t think you (or anyone else) should ignore thier opportunities or privileges. They should seize them and be thankful and if they have more than enough share it with others.
132- You should read a book called the glass castle. it is the true story of people who were intentionally homeless, told from the now adult daughters persepective. it’s fascinating.
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Sobriquet
in July 15th, 2007 @ 19:38I just got back from a semesters worth of Philosophy of Mind, am overjoyed to find a thread on museblog covering philosophy and ethics, and find that it’s a religious debate. I see we’re starting to get back on topic, which is a good sign. Though religion is definitely a part of philosophy, can we leave it for now? Thank you. Alright, so what are everyones views on the nature of consciousness? Personally, I’m on the fence between materialism and monism.
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Sweet Melpomene
in July 17th, 2007 @ 16:55133- Indeed. One step forward, and the entire world pushes three steps back.
135- I rather like the idea of reincarnation. But I just find it impossible to mentally justify, at least right now.
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dark duke of darkness
in July 19th, 2007 @ 01:52138-i would like to belive in reincarnation. very comforting. but it just makes no scientific sense, y’know?
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Robert Coontz (Administrator)
in July 19th, 2007 @ 07:05I’m not sure Zen Buddhists are attached to the idea of reincarnation, or to many doctrines. I think they count as a philosophy rather than a religion. And some Buddhists in Europe and America explicitly reject both reincarnation and karma. One of them, a former monk named Stephen Batchelor, wrote a book about it called Buddhism Without Beliefs.
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dark duke of darkness
in July 20th, 2007 @ 16:09140-i know. i have a friend who’s a “zen practitioner”
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Fortune Cell
in July 26th, 2007 @ 19:59132- If everyone were vegetarian, that wouldn’t stop world hunger.
I’m trying to see how you reached that conclusion…. the people in this world who are starving have little food at all, and if they stopped eating meat, they would be even hungrier…
and this is coming from a vegetarian, btw.
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dark duke of darkness
in August 2nd, 2007 @ 09:54142-to have a cow, it takes a ton of energy. much more so than it would if we were to simply eat the stuff the cow eats. or, more realisticly, use the land and energy we put into making the cow’s food into making human food. i was just out in the country, and i saw massive fields dedicated to making crappy corn for pigs. much more crappy corn than there was wheat. (for humans, but cows eat it too.)
btw, i’m not a vegetarian. i’m an informed omnivore. who likes meat.
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agagabagabag zepata
in September 7th, 2007 @ 18:17*Drools* I have an urge to eat uncooked meat, which is the natural omnivorous passion.
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agagabagabag zepata (trevor the decent)
in September 11th, 2007 @ 18:47COMEHERE!
140- l consider myself to be 2/3 athiest, 1/3 buddhist.
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I, man-gator
in September 11th, 2007 @ 19:34145-? buddhist? nothing of the sort. You’re your own religion now, or you can be aethiest.
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Enceladus and Nimly (*.*)
in June 11th, 2009 @ 15:36Oh, cool name Gimanator! Ana Gram c’est une amie!
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146.1.1
Rebecca Lasley (Administrator)
in June 11th, 2009 @ 15:49Anna Graham — elle est ma tante.
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agagabagabag zepata (trevor the decent)
in September 11th, 2007 @ 19:47It’s not a religion. And it does consist of a lot of buddhist philosophy.
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Vorlon Empire
in August 12th, 2008 @ 11:49I agree with 41
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